From: IN%"m.b.m.bracke@imag.dlo.nl" "Bracke, M.B.M." 11-FEB-2000 14:47:59.29
To: IN%"APPLIED-ETHOLOGY@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Inactivity 'thanks for all your suggestions'
Dear Laura,
I felt a bit sorry for you when I read your last 'thanks to all message'.
You seem to feel to have been skinned alive. Please don't take it
personally. Jeff means well. He has a reputation for writing 'critical
reviews' and stuff, and he can't help it being someone who triggers others
to reply. That's how things go.
Let me now try to give some explanation of inactivity which you asked for.
The crated sows have at least to some extent adapted to living in the crate,
for complete failure to cope would have meant they should have died, which
they obviously didn't. Very likely, therefore, that standing inactive has
become the normal thing for them to do. The loose housed sows, however are
confronted with a change in their abibility to move. Their setpoint/Sollwert
as to movements is set at a higher level and must be adjusted when in the
process of adaptation to a situation with less activity. The increased
difference between Istwert-Sollwert has become larger, which, according to
Wiepkema (I hope I interpret him correctly) will lead to negative emotions.
Therefore, increased inactivity in loose housed sows upon being crated is,
for me, as sign of reduced welfare. The theoretical phramework you are
looking for can be found in P R Wiepkema 'Behavioural aspects of stress' p
113-133 in Wiepkema P.R., Van Adrichem P.W.M. (eds) 1987 'biology of stress
in farm animals: an integrative approach'.
As a philosopher I know doubts can be raised forever and ever. The nice
thing about philosophy is that one habituates to scepticism. Sorry, I get
carried away. Must hang up now.
Regards,
Marc
-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: Laura Boyle [mailto:lboyle@MOOREPARK.TEAGASC.IE]
Verzonden: donderdag 10 februari 2000 17:07
Aan: APPLIED-ETHOLOGY@skyway.usask.ca
Onderwerp: Re: Inactivity
Hi Heather,
Thanks for your suggestions. I may be misinterpreting your message
but it seems to me by your reference to pens that you too are
assuming that I made these observations in two differing
environments. I would just like to clarify that I observed all the
sows in farrowing crates! Anyway I am now becoming paranoid that I
did not explain myself clearly in my original message!
Anyway I realise that was not the main point of your message. I do
agree that it is important to consider how a result will be
interpreted before conducting an experiment and I just want to
clarify that I did that for all the other parameters that pertained
to sow manoeuvrabilty and getting up/lying down behaviour
in farrowing crates ( I know I'm not being 'attacked' but I really
feel like I must defend my poor experiment!). You were suggesting
that a result that hasn't been interpreted before the experiment
should really only be considered in the development of hypotheses for
new experiments. I take it by that you mean that result shouldn't
be mentioned in the findings of an experiment that was designed to
answer a different question? To be honest I hadn't considered how I
would interpret inactivity but I didn't think there was any 'harm'
in offering some suggestions as to how the result came about. I
suppose what you're saying is that theoretically one shouldn't and I
take your point on that.
My main reason for contacting the list was to have a reference
clarified for me however, I now realise that I might have saved some
confusion if I had defined what I meant by 'inactive' which was when
sows were were standing still doing absolutely nothing (i.e. quietly)
in the farrowing crate....... I'll know better in future!
Thanks a million for all your suggestions!
Laura
Pig Production Research Centre,
Moorepark,
Fermoy,
Co. Cork,
IRELAND.
Telephone: +353-25-42389
Fax : +353-25-42340
Email: Lboyle@Moorepark.Teagasc.ie
From: IN%"m.b.m.bracke@imag.dlo.nl" "Bracke, M.B.M." 11-FEB-2000 16:38:58.36
To: IN%"APPLIED-ETHOLOGY@sask.usask.ca" "'APPLIED-ETHOLOGY@skyway.usask.ca'"
CC:
Subj: Intrekken: Inactivity 'thanks for all your suggestions'
From: IN%"m.b.m.bracke@imag.dlo.nl" "Bracke, M.B.M." 11-FEB-2000 16:45:39.50
To: IN%"APPLIED-ETHOLOGY@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Inactivity 'thanks for all your suggestions'
The attentive reader will have noticed I explained the opposite phenomenon.
Proves Jeff's point (which I didn't doubt in the first place anyway).
Marc
From: IN%"Libby20@aol.com" 12-FEB-2000 08:16:20.12
To: IN%"APPLIED-ETHOLOGY@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: inactivity
dear linda,
nice to see someone stimulating some debate on pig behaviour! Just to add the
general comments, the SVC (scientific veterinary committee? standing
veterinary committee?) of the EU produced a report on pig welfare in 1997. In
chapter 4, the "restlessness" of large groups of sows was thought to be
indicative of poor welfare. in chapter 5, the long periods spent lying by
stall housed sows was thought to be indicative of "apathy". So take your pick.
To put these discussions into context, I know six UK pig farmers-
long-established producers of 20 years or more, with large herds, many of
them innovators and an asset to pig production and welfare- who have gone out
of pigs in the past year because of the financial meltdown in the British pig
industry. As the UK pig industry becomes smaller, will the point come when
UK funding bodies think research and development in pig welfare is not
justified? ( this probably isn't of interest to many readers of the list,
but spare a thought for us in the UK - you could be in the same boat one
day!).
sorry to be so negative, but linda's query set me thinking
libby
From: IN%"lboyle@MOOREPARK.TEAGASC.IE" "Laura Boyle" 13-FEB-2000 13:04:01.50
To: IN%"APPLIED-ETHOLOGY@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: inactivity
Hi Libby,
It's 'Laura' not 'Linda' by the way! Anyway I think that the
situation is very similar here in Ireland. The licensing
requirements of the environmental protection agency seem to be
putting the final nails in the coffin of the Irish pig industry.
Currently they require all integrated units of 400 or more sows to be
licensed but apparently they are soon going to stipulate that units
of 200 or more sows must be licensed also. Obviously protection of
the environment is important it's just that the cost of applying
for these licenses and then complying with them is going to be too
much for the smaller producers. I agree with you though......I don't
think the day is too far away when there will be big questions asked
as to how necessary it is for any research on pig production (not to
mind pig welfare!) to be going on in this country.......
Better make sure I don't keep all my eggs in one basket!
Laura
Pig Production Research Centre,
Moorepark,
Fermoy,
Co. Cork,
IRELAND.
telephone: (+353) 025-42389
fax: (+353) 025-42340
email: Lboyle@Moorepark.Teagasc.ie
From: IN%"rmarin@crilar.com.ar" 14-FEB-2000 15:35:10.57
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "Applied Ethology"
CC:
Subj: a new member of the list
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--Boundary_(ID_Rt3xXBX46FLQcfL0YMYXZQ)
Content-type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Hello ISAE list members:
I am a new member of the list and I would like to introduce myself =
briefly.=20
I am from Argentine and my research subjects including stress, behaviour =
and physiology. At present my main line of studies is on T-maze =
classified chicks according to their behaviour at a very early age and =
their later relationship with body weight, stress susceptibility, =
sociality and fear. I am interested in behavioural studies mainly if =
they can have applied implications to improve the welfare as well as the =
productivity of the animals. I look forward to participating in this =
list. If you are interested in similar subjects, please don=B4t doubt to =
contact me. Thank you for including me in the list.
Best wishes
Dr. Ra=FAl H. Mar=EDn=20
Centro Regional de Investigaciones Cient=EDficas
y Transferencia Tecnol=F3gica (CRILAR-CONICET)
Mendoza y Entre R=EDos s/n
Anillaco (5301). La Rioja. Argentina
Tel: 03827 494251; Fax: 03827 494231
rmarin@crilar.com.ar
--Boundary_(ID_Rt3xXBX46FLQcfL0YMYXZQ)
Content-type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Hello ISAE list members:
I am a new member of the list and I would like to introduce myself =
briefly.=20
I am from Argentine and my research subjects including stress, =
behaviour=20
and physiology. At present my main line of studies is on T-maze =
classified=20
chicks according to their behaviour at a very early age and their later=20
relationship with body weight, stress susceptibility, sociality and =
fear. I am=20
interested in behavioural studies mainly if they can have applied =
implications=20
to improve the welfare as well as the productivity of the animals. I =
look=20
forward to participating in this list. If you are interested in similar=20
subjects, please don´t doubt to contact me. Thank you for =
including me in=20
the list.
Best wishes
Dr. Raúl H. Marín
Centro Regional de Investigaciones Científicas
y =
Transferencia=20
Tecnológica (CRILAR-CONICET)
Mendoza y Entre Ríos=20
s/n
Anillaco (5301). La Rioja. Argentina
Tel: 03827 494251; =
Fax:=20
03827 494231
rmarin@crilar.com.ar