From: IN%"k9acad@iafrica.com" 18-JAN-1997 12:18:19.79
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Rage Syndrome
Please can anyone throw some light on so-called "rage syndrome"/idiopathic
aggression.
For the first time in my career I have come across a true Jekylle and Hyde! He
is a 4 year old neutered Border Collie who suddendly presented this behaviour
after a bout of Babesiosis. (Perhaps a high temp. could have caused the onset
of this behaviour?)
He is a text book case from what I can gather - attacking savagely without
provocation and the next minute as sweet as pie.
I think Robin once mentioned successfully treating a spaniel with vitamin B6?
Please Robin can you elaborate?
Has anyone had any success with anti-convulsants? And if so what is the dose
please?
If anyone can please give me any information or help on this subject I'd be
most grateful
Thank you in anticipation.
**********************************************************
NAME : GLYNNE ANDERSON
E-mail : k9acad@iafrica.com
**********************************************************
From: IN%"kckissan@alpha.delta.edu" "Kelly Caithlin Kissane" 18-JAN-1997 12:43:43.39
To: IN%"k9acad@iafrica.com"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "applied-ethology", IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: Rage Syndrome
RE: Rage
I have a golden-retriever/Englihs Springer spaniel mix.
When I took him for dog training, the trainer mentioned that English
Springer spaniels were especially prone to Rage syndrome, and that the cause
was believed to be genetic. English Springer breeders are currently
trying to eliminate it from their lines. She also mentioned that Rage
syndrome doesn't show up until the animal is 2 - 3 years of age.
Kelly C. Kissane
Grad student
Central Michigan University
arachnology/animal behavior
From: IN%"kckissan@alpha.delta.edu" "Kelly Caithlin Kissane" 18-JAN-1997 12:45:57.87
To: IN%"k9acad@iafrica.com"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "applied-ethology", IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: Rage Syndrome
RE: Rage
I have a golden-retriever/Englihs Springer spaniel mix.
When I took him for dog training, the trainer mentioned that English
Springer spaniels were especially prone to Rage syndrome, and that the cause
was believed to be genetic. English Springer breeders are currently
trying to eliminate it from their lines. She also mentioned that Rage
syndrome doesn't show up until the animal is 2 - 3 years of age.
Kelly C. Kissane
Grad student
Central Michigan University
arachnology/animal behavior
From: IN%"aa266@cleveland.Freenet.Edu" 19-JAN-1997 12:27:10.54
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Rage Syndrome
In my experience, most diagnoses of "Rage Syndrome" are from
a veterinary G.P. or a trainer who has met a dog that he/she is
unable to deal with effectively.
Reply to message from kckissan@alpha.delta.edu of Sat, 18 Jan
>
>
> RE: Rage
>
> I have a golden-retriever/Englihs Springer spaniel mix.
> When I took him for dog training, the trainer mentioned that English
>Springer spaniels were especially prone to Rage syndrome, and that the cause
>was believed to be genetic. English Springer breeders are currently
>trying to eliminate it from their lines. She also mentioned that Rage
>syndrome doesn't show up until the animal is 2 - 3 years of age.
>
>
>Kelly C. Kissane
>Grad student
>Central Michigan University
>arachnology/animal behavior
--
DBC (aka D.B. Cameron, DVM)
Animal Behavior Clinic
Middleburg Hts., OH 44130
216/826-0013 Fax: 234-3407
From: IN%"Heeler@aol.com" 19-JAN-1997 15:32:41.12
To: IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Rage Syndrome
Dr. Nicholas Dodman of Tufts University in Massachusetts included a chapter
on "rage syndrome" in his book, THE DOG WHO LOVED TOO MUCH (Bantam Books,
1996)
According to Dodman, accurate diagnosis of seizure-related aggression
requires a history of symptoms, a neurological examination, and an EEG.
He advises exercising extreme caution in dealing with an affected dog,
medicating with phenobarbital, and careful behavior monitoring. Euthanasia,
he says, is a reasonable option. 100-percent cures are rare. He warns
against keeping the dog if there are children in the household.
Cheers,
Margie, NY
From: IN%"nop26342@mail.telepac.pt" "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Nuno_Paix=E3o?=" 19-JAN-1997 18:57:58.93
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Rage Syndrome
I=B4m Veterinary Behaviorist from Portugal, and I agree with Dr. Cameron =
about " Rage Sindrome". The diagnosis from Dominance agression and Rage =
sindrome it=B4s very dificult. But agree that rage sindrome exist but is =
rare.
The real diagnosis of rage sindrome must be done after a few tests, =
like electroencefalogram. I belive that one epiletic focus in agression =
center of the brain can show a very strong agression.
I reenforce that rage sindrome is more rare. It=B4s more likely to be a =
strong dominance agression.
I=B4m sorry for my English but it=B4s not very good. I was in USA for a =
few month working in Animal Behavior Clinic in tufts university but I =
talk better than I write.
Thank you,
Nuno Paix=E3o, DVM, MVABS
Animal Behavior Clinic
Cl=EDnica Veterin=E1ria da Caparica
Portugal
Email: npa@mail.telepac.pt
From: IN%"Petra.Mertens@lrz.uni-muenchen.de" 20-JAN-1997 01:27:51.76
To: IN%"k9acad@iafrica.com", IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Rage Syndrome
Rage vs. dominance aggression.
It is not easy to diagnose properly and decide which problem you`re
facing without a neurologic and behavior examination.
In general, dominant dogs react aggressively in response to certain
stimuli. If the situation occurred again, the likelyhood that the dog
reacts in an aggressive manner the second time is very high.
Usually, the dogs don`t
tolerate dominant gestures or postures (touching their food - giving
commads - make them do things they don`t like - bending over the dog -
touching their back - walking bye too close - etc) including things
which might seem perfectly fine to the "victim". The dogs seem moody
and sometimes, attacks occur more frequently in the afternoon.
As opposed to this, a dog sufferring from rage, will attack without
provocation. The attacks are not related to certain situations.
I would guess that only one out of 100 aggressive dogs suffers from
rage.
Breed predisposition:
Certain breeds are show a higher percentage of dominance aggressive
individuals within the population than others.Engl . Cocker Spaniels and
Springer Spaniels do certainly belong to these groups.
Age:
Dominance aggression becomes a problem (or simply worse) when the
dog matures - most dogs are presented to behavior clinics at age 1 or 2.
Gender:
males are generally more aggressive than females (approx. 2/3 of all dogs
presented to our clinic for aggression are males). This effect is
linked to the influence of testosterone. However, castration is not a
100% sollution in males. Chances to reduce aggression decrease with
age.
Serotonin:
There`s evidence that dominance aggressive dogs have lower monoamine
levels (CSF) compared to unaffected individuals ... treatment with
serotonin reuptake inhibitors (like Prozac ...) is leading to limited
success.
It is thought that the disturbed impulse control is related to
genetic defects (lack of tryptophan hydroxylase and MAOA).
Some Ref FYI:
Dodman et al. (1992). Phenobarbial-responsive episodic dyscontrol
(rage) in dogs. J A V M A 201: 1580-1583.
Dodman et al. (1996) Use of fluoxetine to treat dominance aggression
in dogs. J A V M A 209: 1585-1587.
Reisner et al. (1996). Comparison of CSF monoamine metabolite levels
in dominant aggressive dogs. Brain research. 714: 57-64
Podberscek and Serpell (1996). The english cocker spaniel:
preliminary findings on aggressive behaviour. Appl Anim Beh Sci 47:
75-89.
Kulikov and Popova (1996) Association between intermale aggression
and genetically defined tryptophan hydroxylase activity in the mouse
brain. Aggressive behavior 22: 111-117.
Cases et al. (1995) Aggressive behavior and altered amounts of brain
serotonin and norepinephrine in mice lacking MAOA. Science 268:
1763-1766.
Best wishes,
Petra
______________
Dr. Petra A. Mertens
Institute for Ethology and Animal Welfare
Schwere-Reiter-Str. 9
80797 Muenchen
petra.mertens@lrz.uni-muenchen.de
From: IN%"heath@vetethol.demon.co.uk" "Sarah Heath" 21-JAN-1997 05:27:34.88
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca", IN%"apbc4_um@ftech.net"
CC:
Subj: Feline and Canine addictions
I have been approached by a colleague who is looking for information
regarding feline and canine addictions and I wondered if anyone out there
could help. He is interested in garden plants other than catmint which are
associated with unusual behavioural reactions in cats.He also wants to know
if there is any serious scientific literature regarding cats and dogs that show a
particular liking for and reaction to plants, either outdoor or indoor. He cites
the example of dogs snorting and chewing cannabis and wonders if anyone
has any literature on that specific subject!!
If anyone has anything to offer please contact me!
Sarah Heath
Behavioural Referrals
33 Hayman Road
Brackley
Northants
Tel 01280 705231
Fax 01280 700882
Email heath@vetethol.demon.co.uk
From: IN%"bs5prf@bath.ac.uk" "Paul Ferguson" 21-JAN-1997 10:09:30.69
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Wolves - sociobiology
I am currently engaged in a final-year undergraduate course on
Sociobiology and have been detailed to undertake a study of Wolf behaviour
with regard to social evolution. I have comprehensively searched all the
data bases I can find and have turned up a few interesting things but I
wondered whether anyone would in this group would know of any further
relevant references/contacts. Any help on this is greatly appreciated.
Paul Ferguson.
From: IN%"ascebra@eplinc.com" "Ann Scebra" 21-JAN-1997 10:34:53.29
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "'applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca'"
CC:
Subj: Introduction
Hello network animal lovers. I just signed on to your network today in
order to get as much information on ethology as possible. I will
explain; my daughter is a junior this year and she is wanting to study
animal behavior when she goes to college. She is not sure what the
study consists of, so I found your WEB sight on the NET and thought I
would contact some people that are studying the subject of animals and
report my findings to my daughter Lisa. Is ethology the same as the
study of animal behavior? Please give me any insight on this subject,
(the pro's and cons) that you may feel is important.
Thanks
Ann Scebra
Birmingham, Alabama
USA
Annie
Have a good day!
From: IN%"rushenj@EM.AGR.CA" "Jeff Rushen" 21-JAN-1997 13:58:48.12
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Assoc for the Scientific Study of Consciousness
forwarded by Jeff Rushen rushenj@em.agr.ca
From:
PSYCOLOQUY ISSN 1055-0143 Saturday, 11 January 1997
Newsletter
From: patrickw@cs.monash.edu.au (Patrick Wilken)
Subject: (2) Announcement: Assoc for the Scientific Study of
Consciousness
We would like to call your attention to the Association for the
Scientific Study of Consciousness (ASSC). ASSC is the first scholarly
and scientific membership organization devoted to the study of
consciousness and sister issues. It was set up last year with the aim
of promoting rigorous analytic research on consciousness. The official
purpose of the organization is to encourage research in cognitive
science, neuroscience, philosophy, and other relevant disciplines in
the sciences and humanities, directed toward understanding the nature,
function, and mechanisms of consciousness. Currently most members
come
from the disciplines of cognitive psychology, philosophy, and
neuroscience, but we are open to all scholars with a serious interest
in the study of consciousness.
As you know, the cognitive and brain sciences appear to be at a
historic divide in reintroducing consciousness into scientific
discourse. Philosophers, who have discussed issues of consciousness
for centuries, seem to be coming to new and significant conclusions on
the topic. Major breakthroughs in brain imaging, experimental
psychology, and cognitive ethology have opened new ways to tackle
empirically what has before only been the purview of philosophy. While
no one can predict with certainty, the current boom in consciousness
studies seems to have a solid enough foundation that we expect it to
grow for a number of years.
At the present time we have a board of distinguished contributors, an
executive committee and officers - and only a small number of members.
That was the only way to create ASSC. With the rapid rise in serious
interest in our topic we expect to recruit many more members in the
next year. Meanwhile, we hope you will see your early membership as a
great opportunity to participate at all levels of the organization.
The following projects are now running:
1. ASSC web page. This is the best overall source for information on
ASSC activities, and we encourage you to visit often. You can check it
out at .
2. Conferences. We are holding a three day conference in Claremont
next
June 13th thru 15th. The title of the conference is "What do implicit
processes tell us about consciousness?"
We intend to hold smaller satellite meetings in conjunction with
relevant scientific conferences. This has already been done
successfully in association with the 1995 Psychonomics Society meeting
several months ago, and seems to be a convenient format for members
of
those societies, who can extend their stay by a day or so to attend an
ASSC meeting. If you have suggestions as to other meetings you think
we
should fly our banner at please let us know by contacting Patrick
Wilken .
3. Electronic seminars. Recently our first electronic seminar began,
led by Jim Newman, on the topic of the thalamocortical bases for
conscious experience. The seminar is available through the ASSC
website, and through a specially set-up mailing list - ASSC-V (see the
website for information on how to subscribe to the mailing list). We
are very pleased indeed by the outstanding quality of the seminar
dialogue so far -- log on to our web page and see for yourself. If you
have ideas for future seminar topics please contact our seminar
coordinator Bernard Baars .
4. Official ASSC journals. There are two official journals of the
society for which members are entitled to a discount: "Consciousness &
Cognition" from Academic Press (William P. Banks & Bernard J. Baars
Eds.); and "Psyche: An international journal of research on
consciousness", from The MIT Press (Patrick Wilken Editor-in-Chief).
More details about subscriptions and discounts are available via our
website.
5. Online bibliography. We have uploaded to the ASSC website the
largest scholarly bibliography on consciousness we know of, compiled
by
Thomas Metzinger and David Chalmers. The bibliography is intended as
an
ongoing project. Members are invited to constantly add information
about articles and books as they are published. As the database was
originally developed with a philosophical audience in mind, it needs
more items from other areas. Due to copyright restrictions we can only
offer access to the database to ASSC members at this time.
We would be very interested in hearing from anyone who who would be
willing to take on an active role in upgrading the neuroscience and
cognitive science sections of the database. Also we would like the help
of a programmer to make the database even more responsive to
members -
perhaps allowing members to add comments or reviews of particular
articles. If you can help in either of these matters or if you know of
references not in the database please contact Thomas Metzinger
.
6. Web links. Our website has links to a great number of useful
resources for those interested in the study of consciousness. If you
have any further suggestions please contact Patrick Wilken
.
Your ideas for additional activities are cordially invited.
Sincerely,
Bernie Baars
President
From: IN%"rushenj@EM.AGR.CA" "Jeff Rushen" 21-JAN-1997 15:54:20.61
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: North American regional ISAE meeting
Dear North Americans (or those wanting to become one),
a while ago I sent a message over the network about a conference in
animal welfare to be held in Lennoxville (Quebec--- near Montreal---that
is, in Canada-----you know, that cold place directly north from New York)
on June 6. The plan was to hold a regional meeting of the North American
ISAE the day after (June 7th). Before getting too organized I would like
some idea of how many people would plan to come to such a meeting.
Therefore could you send me a brief message:
1. if you would come to the ISAE meeting
2. if you would present a paper or poster.
Jeff Rushen
rushenj@em.agr.ca
fax: 1-819-5645507
From: IN%"eoprice@ucdavis.edu" "Edward O. Price" 21-JAN-1997 16:45:17.44
To: IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca" "applied-ethology-error"
CC:
Subj: RE: North American regional ISAE meeting
Jeff: I probably will not be able to attend. I am already commited to four
meetings this summer.
Ed Price
----------
>From: applied-ethology-error
>To: applied-ethology
>Subject: North American regional ISAE meeting
>Date: Tuesday, January 21, 1997 4:53PM
>
>Dear North Americans (or those wanting to become one),
>
>a while ago I sent a message over the network about a conference in
>animal welfare to be held in Lennoxville (Quebec--- near Montreal---that
>is, in Canada-----you know, that cold place directly north from New York)
>on June 6. The plan was to hold a regional meeting of the North American
>ISAE the day after (June 7th). Before getting too organized I would like
>some idea of how many people would plan to come to such a meeting.
>
>Therefore could you send me a brief message:
>
>1. if you would come to the ISAE meeting
>
>2. if you would present a paper or poster.
>
>Jeff Rushen
>
>rushenj@em.agr.ca
>
>fax: 1-819-5645507
>
From: IN%"mike.mendl@bristol.ac.uk" "Mike Mendl" 22-JAN-1997 03:34:27.30
To: IN%"Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: address change - correction
Dear all,
An error already. My new tel. no. is 0117 928 9485 (NOT 9458).
Sorry!
Best wishes,
Mike Mendl
From: IN%"rushenj@em.agr.ca" "Jeff Rushen" 22-JAN-1997 04:21:07.58
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: North American regional ISAE meeting
Dear North Americans (or those wanting to become one),
a while ago I sent a message over the network about a conference in
animal welfare to be held in Lennoxville (Quebec--- near Montreal---that
is, in Canada-----you know, that cold place directly north from New York)
on June 6. The plan was to hold a regional meeting of the North American
ISAE the day after (June 7th). Before getting too organized I would like
some idea of how many people would plan to come to such a meeting.
Therefore could you send me a brief message:
1. if you would come to the ISAE meeting
2. if you would present a paper or poster.
Jeff Rushen
rushenj@em.agr.ca
fax: 1-819-56455
From: IN%"rushenj@em.agr.ca" "Jeff Rushen" 22-JAN-1997 04:21:30.32
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: North American regional ISAE meeting
Dear North Americans (or those wanting to become one),
a while ago I sent a message over the network about a conference in
animal welfare to be held in Lennoxville (Quebec--- near Montreal---that
is, in Canada-----you know, that cold place directly north from New York)
on June 6. The plan was to hold a regional meeting of the North American
ISAE the day after (June 7th). Before getting too organized I would like
some idea of how many people would plan to come to such a meeting.
Therefore could you send me a brief message:
1. if you would come to the ISAE meeting
2. if you would present a paper or poster.
Jeff Rushen
rushenj@em.agr.ca
fax: 1-819-56455
From: IN%"rushenj@em.agr.ca" "Jeff Rushen" 22-JAN-1997 04:21:58.05
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Assoc for the Scientific Study of Consciousness
forwarded by Jeff Rushen rushenj@em.agr.ca
From:
PSYCOLOQUY ISSN 1055-0143 Saturday, 11 January 1997
Newsletter
From: patrickw@cs.monash.edu.au (Patrick Wilken)
Subject: (2) Announcement: Assoc for the Scientific Study of
Consciousness
We would like to call your attention to the Association for the
Scientific Study of Consciousness (ASSC). ASSC is the first scholarly
and scientific membership organization devoted to the study of
consciousness and sister issues. It was set up last year with the aim
of promoting rigorous analytic research on consciousness. The official
purpose of the organization is to encourage research in cognitive
science, neuroscience, philosophy, and other relevant disciplines in
the sciences and humanities, directed toward understanding the nature,
function, and mechanisms of consciousness. Currently most members
come
from the disciplines of cognitive psychology, philosophy, and
neuroscience, but we are open to all scholars with a serious interest
in the study of consciousness.
As you know, the cognitive and brain sciences appear to be at a
historic divide in reintroducing consciousness into scientific
discourse. Philosophers, who have discussed issues of consciousness
for centuries, seem to be coming to new and significant conclusions on
the topic. Major breakthroughs in brain imaging, experimental
psychology, and cognitive ethology have opened new ways to tackle
empirically what has before only been the purview of philosophy. While
no one can predict with certainty, the current boom in consciousness
studies seems to have a solid enough foundation that we expect it to
grow for a number of years.
At the present time we have a board of distinguished contributors, an
executive committee and officers - and only a small number of members.
That was the only way to create ASSC. With the rapid rise in serious
interest in our topic we expect to recruit many more members in the
next year. Meanwhile, we hope you will see your early membership as a
great opportunity to participate at all levels of the organization.
The following projects are now running:
1. ASSC web page. This is the best overall source for information on
ASSC activities, and we encourage you to visit often. You can check it
out at .
2. Conferences. We are holding a three day conference in Claremont
next
June 13th thru 15th. The title of the conference is "What do implicit
processes tell us about consciousness?"
We intend to hold smaller satellite meetings in conjunction with
relevant scientific conferences. This has already been done
successfully in association with the 1995 Psychonomics Society meeting
several months ago, and seems to be a convenient format for members
of
those societies, who can extend their stay by a day or so to attend an
ASSC meeting. If you have suggestions as to other meetings you think
we
should fly our banner at please let us know by contacting Patrick
Wilken .
3. Electronic seminars. Recently our first electronic seminar began,
led by Jim Newman, on the topic of the thalamocortical bases for
conscious experience. The seminar is available through the ASSC
website, and through a specially set-up mailing list - ASSC-V (see the
website for information on how to subscribe to the mailing list). We
are very pleased indeed by the outstanding quality of the seminar
dialogue so far -- log on to our web page and see for yourself. If you
have ideas for future seminar topics please contact our seminar
coordinator Bernard Baars .
4. Official ASSC journals. There are two official journals of the
society for which members are entitled to a discount: "Consciousness &
Cognition" from Academic Press (William P. Banks & Bernard J. Baars
Eds.); and "Psyche: An international journal of research on
consciousness", from The MIT Press (Patrick Wilken Editor-in-Chief).
More details about subscriptions and discounts are available via our
website.
5. Online bibliography. We have uploaded to the ASSC website the
largest scholarly bibliography on consciousness we know of, compiled
by
Thomas Metzinger and David Chalmers. The bibliography is intended as
an
ongoing project. Members are invited to constantly add information
about articles and books as they are published. As the database was
originally developed with a philosophical audience in mind, it needs
more items from other areas. Due to copyright restrictions we can only
offer access to the database to ASSC members at this time.
We would be very interested in hearing from anyone who who would be
willing to take on an active role in upgrading the neuroscience and
cognitive science sections of the database. Also we would like the help
of a programmer to make the database even more responsive to
members -
perhaps allowing members to add comments or reviews of particular
articles. If you can help in either of these matters or if you know of
references not in the database please contact Thomas Metzinger
.
6. Web links. Our website has links to a great number of useful
resources for those interested in the study of consciousness. If you
have any further suggestions please contact Patrick Wilken
.
Your ideas for additional activities are cordially invited.
Sincerely,
Bernie Baars
President
From: IN%"TAYLORA@EM.AGR.CA" "Allison Taylor" 22-JAN-1997 08:30:16.78
To: IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: North American regional ISAE meeting -Reply
Jeff -
Yes on both counts.
Allison
Allison Taylor, PhD
Centre for Food & Animal Research
Agriculture & Agri-Food Canada
Ottawa, ON taylora@em.agr.ca
>>> 01/21/97 05:05pm >>>
Dear North Americans (or those wanting to become one),
a while ago I sent a message over the network about a conference in
animal welfare to be held in Lennoxville (Quebec--- near Montreal---that
is, in Canada-----you know, that cold place directly north from New York)
on June 6. The plan was to hold a regional meeting of the North American
ISAE the day after (June 7th). Before getting too organized I would like
some idea of how many people would plan to come to such a meeting.
Therefore could you send me a brief message:
1. if you would come to the ISAE meeting
2. if you would present a paper or poster.
Jeff Rushen
rushenj@em.agr.ca
fax: 1-819-5645507
From: IN%"lhenley@MUW.Edu" "Lani Lyman-Henley" 22-JAN-1997 10:18:41.92
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "International Society for Applied Ethology"
CC:
Subj: wolf hybrids and deer meat
Sorry, Sir Moderator, but I sent this first to the wrong address. I think
I got it right this time :)
Greetings and happy new year :)
I know that there are plenty of folks on this list interested in dogs in
general and a few interested in wolf-hybrids in specific, so I thought I'd
toss out a question, albeit not very weighty. :)
Yesterday I found my 2 dogs (one a wolf-hybrid) merrily chewing on the
entire hind leg of a deer. Apparantly the neighbors butchered their deer
in the carport and left the bagged remains there (they missed the garbage
pickup). My dogs discovered the bag and you can picture the rest. The
lucky hunters seemed very worried that I'd be upset that the dogs got hold
of the carcass, while I had been worried they got it *before* it had been
butchered!
There seems to be a common idea that dogs shouldn't be allowed to eat
fresh deer meat; that it gives them a "taste for blood" and may cause
them to become more vicious. Other than a chance for picking up parasites,
this doesn't seem likely to me on its face. Is there any real evidence
either way (particularly with regard to hybrids)?
***********************************************************************
Lani Lyman-Henley, PhD email: lhenley@MUW.edu
Division of Science & Math phone: (601) 329-7245 (office)
Mississippi University for Women P.O.Box W 100
Columbus, MS 39701 FAX: (601) 329-7238
WWW: http://www.msstate.edu/Dept/Psychology/lplh.html*See my baby picture!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside a dog, it's too
dark to read." --Groucho Marx
***********************************************************************
From: IN%"atp@servidor.unam.mx" "Alberto Tejeda Perea" 23-JAN-1997 13:36:06.43
To: IN%"Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "Int.Soc.Applied Etology"
CC:
Subj: looking for a broiler ethogram
I need some help. My name is Alberto Tejeda Perea and I'm a master degree
student.I'm working at Ethology and Wildlife Departament at Veterinary
Faculty of Universidad Nacional Autonoma de Mexico in Mexico City.
My research proyect is about stress measurements on broilers and the
enviromental enrichment effects on stress levels. I'm looking for some
information about individual behavior in poultry and their social
interactions, I will prefer these information in an ethogram way. And the
effects of toys, like cold drinks cans and the use of perchs in enviromental
enrichment
I will really apreciate any help, it is important to have the most recently
information about these. Thankyou
Sincerely . Alberto Tejeda.
From: IN%"serpell@vet.upenn.edu" 23-JAN-1997 13:39:04.98
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: postdoc position available
POSTDOCTORAL POSITION AVAILABLE
__________________________________________________________
A postdoctoral position (2 years) is available at the School of Veterinary
Medicine, University of Pennsylvania for a person to study the development
of behavior problems in domestic dogs. The study will involve recruiting
and interviewing dog owners, observing dog behavior, and developing and
validating questionnaire methods for obtaining accurate and reliable
behavioral assessments of dogs from their owners.
QUALIFICATIONS: PhD or equivalent in animal behavior/psychology/sociology;
research experience with survey methods and multivariate statistical
analysis essential; good interpersonal communication skills, and knowledge
of dog and/or animal behavior/ethology desirable. Salary in the range:
$19,608-29,500 depending on relevant experience.
Send letter of application, recent CV, and names, phone/fax numbers/email
addresses of at least three referees to:
Dr. James A. Serpell
___________________________________________________________________
School of Veterinary Medicine,
Dept. of Clinical Studies,
University of Pennsylvania,
3900 Delancey Street,
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6010.
USA.
Tel: (215) 898-1004
Fax: (215) 573-6050
serpell@vet.upenn.edu
From: IN%"brousset@servidor.unam.mx" "Dulce Brousset" 23-JAN-1997 13:53:01.10
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "Applied Ethology"
CC:
Subj: Looking for small wild cats ethogram
To whom it may concern;
I'm a veterinarian working at the Ethology and Wildlife Department of the
Veterinary College, at the National University of Mexico; and also a PhD
student with the project: "Comparative study on environmental enrichment,
welfare and captive breeding of ocelots, margays and jaguarundis".
And, as part of it, we are looking for small wild cats ethograms, specially
from these mexican species; but we would be glad reviewing all the small
felid behaviour references decriptions. And also we are interest if knowing
if there are references on some of the other mexican felids: jaguars, pumas
and bobcats for future researchs.
I'll really appreciate any comment, information or reference that you think
that could help related with the project.
Looking forward receiving news from you, sincerely. MVZ Dulce Brousset.
From: IN%"lhenley@MUW.Edu" "Lani Lyman-Henley" 23-JAN-1997 15:01:40.08
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "International Society for Applied Ethology"
CC:
Subj: wolfy responses
Just wanted to thank the various folks who've responded to my query about
deer meat and dogs/wolf-hybrids. I've enjoyed the stories and comments
I've gotten so far! Monty Sloan sent some interesting behavioral
(and physical) observations regarding dog and wolf responses to fresh
meat, which may help explain where such ideas start (regarding primarily
possessiveness of a special treat).
Actually, I thought of one other note of interest (for you doggy types)
regarding this story...I noticed that Kodiak (the hybrid) guarded the leg
from Spencer (the dog) in the yard, but roles reversed when they were
returned to their kennel. Spencer is older and I've noticed he is very
territorial (good watchdog), but I was still surprised to see the apparant
dominance roles change in different places. (BTW, both relinquished the
leg to *me* promptly and without fuss :) )
Woof. ;>
***********************************************************************
Lani Lyman-Henley, PhD email: lhenley@MUW.edu
Division of Science & Math phone: (601) 329-7245 (office)
Mississippi University for Women P.O.Box W 100
Columbus, MS 39701 FAX: (601) 329-7238
WWW: http://www.msstate.edu/Dept/Psychology/lplh.html
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"What you see with your eyes shut is what counts."
-Sioux Medicine Man Lame Deer
***********************************************************************
From: IN%"d.arey@ab.sac.ac.uk" 24-JAN-1997 08:16:16.64
To: IN%"Applied-Ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: F de Jonge email address
Dear All
Does anyone know of an email address for Francien de Jonge,
Wageningen?
Thanks
Dale
Dale Arey
Animal and Feed Technology
SAC
Craibstone Estate
Bucksburn
Aberdeen, AB21 9YA
UK
AB21 9YA
Tel: 01224 711058
From: IN%"d.arey@ab.sac.ac.uk" 24-JAN-1997 08:16:55.62
To: IN%"Applied-Ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: F de Jonge email
Dear All
Does anyone know of an email address for Francien de Jonge,
Wageningen.
Thanks
Dale
Dale Arey
Animal and Feed Technology
SAC
Craibstone Estate
Bucksburn
Aberdeen, AB21 9YA
UK
AB21 9YA
Tel: 01224 711058
From: IN%"k9acad@iafrica.com" 24-JAN-1997 09:42:23.02
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Rage syndrome
To all those who wrote to me re. "rage" - your input was invaluable.
Thank you so much.
Very best wishes
GLYNNE ANDERSON
k9acad@iafrica.com
From: IN%"CROWELL-DAVIS.S@calc.vet.uga.edu" "Sharon Crowell-Davis" 24-JAN-1997 11:40:59.18
To: IN%"k9acad@iafrica.com"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: Rage Syndrome
We have had cases in which the dog abruptly begins intensely
aggressive behavior which is independent of external stimuli,
followed by an abrupt return to being a "good dog", which responded to
anticonvulsants. (I'd have to go digging into old case records to
find the exact doses used.) One problem with treating aggressive-type
psychomotor epilepsy is that, as with any epilepsy, you can have
break-through seizures and in this case, the break-through seizure
can result in substantial human injury. In any case, if this is suspected,
I'd have a specialist in neurology evaluate the dog.
Sharon Crowell-Davis
> Date: Sat, 18 Jan 1997 18:19:32 +0000 (GMT)
> From: k9acad@iafrica.com
> Subject: Re: Rage Syndrome
> To: applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca (applied-ethology)
> Please can anyone throw some light on so-called "rage syndrome"/idiopathic
> aggression.
>
> For the first time in my career I have come across a true Jekylle and Hyde! He
> is a 4 year old neutered Border Collie who suddendly presented this behaviour
> after a bout of Babesiosis. (Perhaps a high temp. could have caused the onset
> of this behaviour?)
>
> He is a text book case from what I can gather - attacking savagely without
> provocation and the next minute as sweet as pie.
>
> I think Robin once mentioned successfully treating a spaniel with vitamin B6?
> Please Robin can you elaborate?
>
> Has anyone had any success with anti-convulsants? And if so what is the dose
> please?
>
> If anyone can please give me any information or help on this subject I'd be
> most grateful
>
> Thank you in anticipation.
>
> **********************************************************
> NAME : GLYNNE ANDERSON
> E-mail : k9acad@iafrica.com
>
> **********************************************************
>
>
>
>
**********************************************
Sharon L. Crowell-Davis DVM, PhD
Diplomate, American College of Veterinary Behaviorists
College of Veterinary Medicine
University of Georgia
Athens, Georgia 30602
706-542-8343
FAX 706-542-0051
Email crowell-davis.s@calc.vet.uga.edu
If a little knowledge is dangerous,
where is the man who has so much
as to be out of danger?
T.H. Huxley
On Elementary Instruction in Physiology
From: IN%"dacserm@biol.unipr.it" 24-JAN-1997 12:55:04.33
To: IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: F de Jonge email
At 15:47 24/01/97, applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca wrote:
>Dear All
>
>Does anyone know of an email address for Francien de Jonge,
>Wageningen.
>
>Thanks
>
>Dale
>
>
>Dale Arey
>Animal and Feed Technology
>SAC
>Craibstone Estate
>Bucksburn
>Aberdeen, AB21 9YA
>UK
>AB21 9YA
>Tel: 01224 711058
>
Francien H. De Jonge, Dept. Anim. Husb., Univ. Wageningen,
email: franciendejonge@etho.vh.wau.nl
Davide Csermely
--
_________________________________________________________________________
Davide Csermely Assoc.Prof. Vertebrate Zoology
Dip. Biologia Evolutiva e Funzionale Intl. Phone: +39-521-905632
Universita` di Parma Intl. Fax : +39-521-905657
Viale delle Scienze Email: DACSERM@biol.unipr.it
43100 Parma, Italy URL : http://www.biol.unipr.it
_________________________________________________________________________
From: IN%"marithe@mandic.com.br" "maria thereza" 25-JAN-1997 17:08:51.32
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: rage sindrome
At 12:38 24/01/97 -0500, you wrote:
>We have had cases in which the dog abruptly begins intensely
>aggressive behavior which is independent of external stimuli,
>followed by an abrupt return to being a "good dog", which responded to
>anticonvulsants. (I'd have to go digging into old case records to
>find the exact doses used.) One problem with treating aggressive-type
>psychomotor epilepsy is that, as with any epilepsy, you can have
>break-through seizures and in this case, the break-through seizure
>can result in substantial human injury. In any case, if this is suspected,
>I'd have a specialist in neurology evaluate the dog.
>
>Sharon Crowell-Davis
>
>If you have some bibliography about this , I would like to know . It is
very dangereus , complicate and dificult cases .
maria thereza cera galvao do amaral
veterinarian (medica veterinaria )
maria.thereza@mandic.com.br
marithe@mandic.com.br ( POP )
Sao Paulo - Brasil
From: IN%"striquer@sercomtel.com.br" "Francisco Striquer Soares" 25-JAN-1997 20:05:58.69
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: wild bird behaviour
My name is Elisiario Strike Soares (I am using the e-mail of my brother
Francisco), I am a master degree student of Universidade Federal do Paran=E1=
,
Curitiba, PR - Brasil.
I am working with Birds of forest (behaviour, nesting, feeding, etc.) I
would like to know if there are somebody who have informations about wild
birds behaviour (main Passeriformes) on Neotropical region.
I will apreciate any help
Thankyou
Sincerely Elisiario Strike Soares.
striquer@pop.sercomtel.com.br
From: IN%"H.Randle@plymouth.ac.uk" "Hayley Randle" 27-JAN-1997 09:16:00.60
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: equine facial expressions
Hello,
I have recently been made aware that some work has been published on
equine facial expressions. Does anyone know where this has been
published and indeed who has done the work?
Thanks for your time,
Hayley
(Dr. Hayley Randle)
From: IN%"Frank.Odberg@rug.ac.be" "Frank Odberg" 28-JAN-1997 04:21:24.25
To: IN%"H.Randle@plymouth.ac.uk" "Hayley Randle"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca", IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: equine facial expressions
Dear Hayley,
I don't know about recent studies focussing on facial expressions (if
there are I would be interested to hear about them myself). In most books
on horse behaviour you will find a chapter on those parts of the ethogram.
As far as I know, they are only descriptive. One can find discriptions
already in articles by the pioneers of horse behaviour from the 30-ties
till the 60-ties.
Look for names such as Antonius, Grzimek, Schloeth, Trumler, Zeeb. Most of
these publications are in German. Michael Schaffer gives personal
"interpretations" of expressions in his book "Die Sprache des Pferdes"
(has been translated: "The Language of the Horse").
I have no time now to type all the references here. If you can't find
them, tell me and I can send you a photocopy of the literature from my
B.Sc. thesis from 1969.
I send you an courteous neigh.
Frank
Prof.Dr. Frank O. Odberg
University of Ghent
Dpt. of Animal Nutrition, Genetics, Production and Ethology
Heidestraat 19
B-9820 Merelbeke
Belgium
tel: +32-(0)9-2521941
fax: 5304
From: IN%"Frank.Odberg@rug.ac.be" "Frank Odberg" 28-JAN-1997 04:23:59.08
To: IN%"H.Randle@plymouth.ac.uk" "Hayley Randle"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca", IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: equine facial expressions
Dear Hayley,
I don't know about recent studies focussing on facial expressions (if
there are I would be interested to hear about them myself). In most books
on horse behaviour you will find a chapter on those parts of the ethogram.
As far as I know, they are only descriptive. One can find discriptions
already in articles by the pioneers of horse behaviour from the 30-ties
till the 60-ties.
Look for names such as Antonius, Grzimek, Schloeth, Trumler, Zeeb. Most of
these publications are in German. Michael Schaffer gives personal
"interpretations" of expressions in his book "Die Sprache des Pferdes"
(has been translated: "The Language of the Horse").
I have no time now to type all the references here. If you can't find
them, tell me and I can send you a photocopy of the literature from my
B.Sc. thesis from 1969.
I send you an courteous neigh.
Frank
Prof.Dr. Frank O. Odberg
University of Ghent
Dpt. of Animal Nutrition, Genetics, Production and Ethology
Heidestraat 19
B-9820 Merelbeke
Belgium
tel: +32-(0)9-2521941
fax: 5304
From: IN%"D.Goodwin@soton.ac.uk" "debbie goodwin" 28-JAN-1997 06:20:17.46
To: IN%"H.Randle@plymouth.ac.uk" "Hayley Randle"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca", IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: equine facial expressions
Hayley,
The best descriptions I've found, including illustrations, are in books by
Horse Behaviour
George Waring
1983
Noyes Publications
ISBN 0815509278
The Horse's Mind
Lucy Rees
1984
Stanley Paul
ISBN 009153660X
There are several agonistic ethograms in research papers which include
descriptions of facial expressions during aggressive encounters, and I can
provide details if necessary; but that's only part of the story, so the books
above give a better all round description.
Best wishes
Debbie
D.Goodwin@soton.ac.uk
From: IN%"D.Goodwin@soton.ac.uk" "debbie goodwin" 28-JAN-1997 06:22:12.81
To: IN%"H.Randle@plymouth.ac.uk" "Hayley Randle"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca", IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: equine facial expressions
Hayley,
The best descriptions I've found, including illustrations, are in books by
Horse Behaviour
George Waring
1983
Noyes Publications
ISBN 0815509278
The Horse's Mind
Lucy Rees
1984
Stanley Paul
ISBN 009153660X
There are several agonistic ethograms in research papers which include
descriptions of facial expressions during aggressive encounters, and I can
provide details if necessary; but that's only part of the story, so the books
above give a better all round description.
Best wishes
Debbie
D.Goodwin@soton.ac.uk
From: IN%"appleby@petbcent.demon.co.uk" "David Appleby" 28-JAN-1997 13:24:20.09
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: George Quinlan
I think a George Quinlan has posted to this list in the past. If you are out
there George please mail me your e-mail address.
Speak to you soon.
David
============================================
Name:David Appleby
Address:The Pet Behaviour Centre,
Upper street, Defford, Worcestershire.
WR8 9AB.England.
Phone and fax:+44(0)1386 750615
E-mail:appleby@petbcent.demon.co.uk
WWW: http://webzone1.co.uk/www/apbc/pbc.htm
============================================
From: IN%"ju56359@televar.com" "Michael Ubelaker" 28-JAN-1997 16:46:07.85
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: canine/feline to human greeting behaviors
I am interested in any instances and references for domesticated canine
and feline greeting behaviors as they relate to humans, Changes in
behavior that help to communicate across species lines, if (and why)
these behaviors seem to be true to species when the greetings pass from
dog to cat, but differ when humans are in the equation.
Also interested in hearing anyone else's opinion on the article in
February's SMITHSONIAN relating to "dog thought". (Phenomena,
Comments, and Notes; by John P Wiley jr.)
Thanks, Jennifer Ubelaker
From: IN%"robin@coape.win-uk.net" "Robin E Walker" 29-JAN-1997 11:37:55.67
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Phenypropanalamine induced Aggression
I urgently need information about any cases of aggression in dogs
being triggered by medication with the alpha-noradrenaline agonist
phenylpropanalamine for urinary tract dysfunction.
Robin E Walker MRCVS
From: IN%"galindof@servidor.unam.mx" "Victor Galves" 29-JAN-1997 13:15:12.50
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: discussion on pain in fishes
Hello everyone !
I work in on fish pathology in the Vet School at the University of Mexico.
I heard that in your group you had a discussion on fish pain.
Does anyone who filed the exchange of opinions can send them to me ?
I will be of great use and interest.
Most grateful
Victor Galves
Depto. de Etologia y Fauna Silvestre
Fac. de Medicina Veterinaria y Zootecnia
UNAM Ciudad Universitaria
04510 Mexico D.F.
MEXICO
Tel. 52 5 6225859
Fax 52 5 5508697
From: IN%"galindof@servidor.unam.mx" "francisco galindo" 29-JAN-1997 16:24:20.40
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: discussion on pain in fish
Hello everyone !
I work in on fish pathology in the Vet School at the University of Mexico.
I heard that in your group you had a discussion on fish pain.
Does anyone who filed the exchange of opinions can send them to me ?
I will be of great use and interest.
Most grateful
Victor Galves
Depto. de Etologia y Fauna Silvestre
Fac. de Medicina Veterinaria y Zootecnia
UNAM Ciudad Universitaria
04510 Mexico D.F.
MEXICO
Tel. 52 5 6225859
Fax 52 5 5508697
From: IN%"SPAZUR@gcwf.com" "Shannon Pazur" 29-JAN-1997 19:14:43.42
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Introduction
Hello everyone! I'm fairly new to the network and wanted to take a
moment to introduce myself. I recently graduated from college with a
degree in Biological Anthropology & Anatomy, where the concentration
of my coursework was in primate behavior and conservation. I am
considering attending graduate school for primatology and/or animal
behavior, and am seeking advice on university programs here in the
United States. Any thoughts at all would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
in advance.
Shannon Pazur
spazur@gcwf.com
From: IN%"bob-nita@neosoft.com" "Robert E. Armstrong" 29-JAN-1997 22:15:38.33
To: IN%"Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Advice
I am a retired veterinarian with quite a bit of practical experience
with aggressive dogs. Lately I consult with attorneys and victims of
animal attack. One of my clients is in the courts now and the court has
suggested that as terms of a settlement of a pending law suit, his
neighbor will be directed to have his extremely vicious Rottweiler
castrated and then undergo behavioral therapy. The man has already had
his Husky nearly killed and his 16 year old daughter threatened. He
likes the idea of castration (probably a little revenge) but he does not
trust the idea of the dog getting psycho-therapy. Personally I go along
with him, but I thought I'd ask the experts. Once bitten, twice shy.
Thank you for any assistance.
Sincerely,
Robert E. Armstrong DVM MS
Houston, TX
From: IN%"aa266@cleveland.Freenet.Edu" 29-JAN-1997 22:38:30.53
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: canine/feline to human greeting behaviors
Reply to message from ju56359@televar.com of Tue, 28 Jan
>
>I am interested in any instances and references for domesticated canine
>and feline greeting behaviors as they relate to humans, Changes in
>behavior that help to communicate across species lines, if (and why)
>these behaviors seem to be true to species when the greetings pass from
>dog to cat, but differ when humans are in the equation.
>Also interested in hearing anyone else's opinion on the article in
>February's SMITHSONIAN relating to "dog thought". (Phenomena,
>Comments, and Notes; by John P Wiley jr.)
>Thanks, Jennifer Ubelaker
>
As I see it, dogs and humans are much closer socially and have much
more similar body language communication than dogs and cats. It is as if
dogs and humans speak Spanish and Italian body language, while cats speak
Norwegian.
--
DBC (aka D.B. Cameron, DVM)
Animal Behavior Clinic
Middleburg Hts., OH 44130
216/826-0013 Fax: 234-3407
From: IN%"aa266@cleveland.Freenet.Edu" 29-JAN-1997 22:58:13.82
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Advice
Reply to message from bob-nita@neosoft.com of Wed, 29 Jan
>
>I am a retired veterinarian with quite a bit of practical experience
>with aggressive dogs. Lately I consult with attorneys and victims of
>animal attack. One of my clients is in the courts now and the court has
>suggested that as terms of a settlement of a pending law suit, his
>neighbor will be directed to have his extremely vicious Rottweiler
>castrated and then undergo behavioral therapy. The man has already had
>his Husky nearly killed and his 16 year old daughter threatened. He
>likes the idea of castration (probably a little revenge) but he does not
>trust the idea of the dog getting psycho-therapy. Personally I go along
>with him, but I thought I'd ask the experts. Once bitten, twice shy.
> Thank you for any assistance.
> Sincerely,
> Robert E. Armstrong DVM MS
> Houston, TX
Since effective therapy for canine behavior problems absolutely
requires that the handler be fully cooperative and committed to the
therapy and the goals of the therapy, in a case like this the outlook for
success would seem highly unlikely to hopeless. That is, one must assume
that the Rotty owner either approves of his dog's behavior or he has no
control over it. In either case, therapy to change the dog becomes
impossible. The only hope for success would be if the owner really wants
the dog to change, and has the courage, commitment, time, and money to apply
to the task. Even then, safety can never be perfectly assured.
--
DBC (aka D.B. Cameron, DVM)
Animal Behavior Clinic
Middleburg Hts., OH 44130
216/826-0013 Fax: 234-3407
From: IN%"F.Toates@open.ac.uk" "F.Toates (Fred Toates)" 30-JAN-1997 03:41:04.85
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: an hysterical dobermann
Dear All,
Our 4 year old female Dobermann goes hysterical when you try to clip her
toe-nails, so much so that she now looks like Howard Hughes. She only gets
clipped when she goes into kennels. Any advice on how to do it without driving
her crazy?
Regards,
Fred
From: IN%"heath@vetethol.demon.co.uk" "Sarah Heath" 30-JAN-1997 07:22:56.57
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Help please !
If anyone has the Email address for Kersti Seksel can they PLEASE let me
have it as soon as possible. My Email address book has been wiped and I
need to contact her urgently
Many thanks
Sarah
Sarah Heath
Behavioural Referrals
33 Hayman Road
Brackley
Northants
NN13 6JA
England
Tel 44 1280 705231
Fax 44 1280 700882
Email heath@vetethol.demon.co.uk
From: IN%"kckissan@alpha.delta.edu" "Kelly Caithlin Kissane" 30-JAN-1997 09:03:38.48
To: IN%"ascebra@eplinc.com" "Ann Scebra"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "'applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca'", IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: Information
Ms. Scerba,
Please dont' discourage your daughter from pursuing a career that woul
make her happy, despite the fact that it's not high-profile or has a large
salary attached.
Since I was 4 years old, I was fascinated by bugs and other animals. My
first experiment involved capturing several worms and raising them to see
if they turned into snakes. To my 4 year ol mind, the fact that both were
legless meant that they must be the same, the worms had to be baby snakes!
My mother, horrified that her eldest daughter played with bugs and worms
instead of dolls and teacups, strongly discouraged my exploration, to the
point of punishing me if she saw me handling bugs.
The result was a young woman who pursued parentally acceptable careers
like becoming a doctor and failed miserably because it truly wasn't what I
wanted to do!
Now at 35, I'm in graduate school doing what I love, what I had always
loved - studying entomology and animal behavior.
Yes, the career is very tough, the pay is low. But I'm happy.
I woudl suggest that when she enters college, that she apply for
undergraduate internships during the summer. She will be doing actual
research, and will iscover the hard work and tedium. There will be plenty
of time to change majors if she decides that is not what she wants to do.
And Many, many universities have undergraduate internships during the
summer.
And yes, there are several other avenues that will allow her to work
with animals. Forestry, wildlife technicians, zoo personnel, etc. The
jobs are there for those who are persistent enough.
Kelly C. Kissane
Grad student
Central Michigan University
arachnology/animal behavior
From: IN%"ascebra@eplinc.com" "Ann Scebra" 30-JAN-1997 09:20:21.87
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "'applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca'"
CC:
Subj: Information
Hi everyone, I introduced myself to all of you a couple of weeks ago,
but for you new comers, my name is Ann, my daughter Lisa wants to study
animal behaviour when she graduates from high school. She is a junior
right now so she has a couple of years to decide. I need advise to
share with her on this study. She knows that it's hard work but I don't
think she realizes how time consuming and how monotonous the study can
be. She also thinks that it's easy to get a job once you have a degree
and that you can make lots of money doing this. Someone please e-mail
her and tell her the facts. I don't want my only child making any
decisions that she may regret later. Also, are there other studies that
she may want to consider, she does want to work with animals, but she
doesn't want to go into veterinary medicine.
PLEASE HELP!!!!
Hans, If you're online please send your e-mail again that was sent
yesterday, I lost it. My computer crashed.
Annie
Have a good day!
From: IN%"kckissan@alpha.delta.edu" "Kelly Caithlin Kissane" 30-JAN-1997 09:20:38.11
To: IN%"ascebra@eplinc.com" "Ann Scebra"
CC: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca" "'applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca'", IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: Information
Ms. Scerba,
Please dont' discourage your daughter from pursuing a career that woul
make her happy, despite the fact that it's not high-profile or has a large
salary attached.
Since I was 4 years old, I was fascinated by bugs and other animals. My
first experiment involved capturing several worms and raising them to see
if they turned into snakes. To my 4 year ol mind, the fact that both were
legless meant that they must be the same, the worms had to be baby snakes!
My mother, horrified that her eldest daughter played with bugs and worms
instead of dolls and teacups, strongly discouraged my exploration, to the
point of punishing me if she saw me handling bugs.
The result was a young woman who pursued parentally acceptable careers
like becoming a doctor and failed miserably because it truly wasn't what I
wanted to do!
Now at 35, I'm in graduate school doing what I love, what I had always
loved - studying entomology and animal behavior.
Yes, the career is very tough, the pay is low. But I'm happy.
I woudl suggest that when she enters college, that she apply for
undergraduate internships during the summer. She will be doing actual
research, and will iscover the hard work and tedium. There will be plenty
of time to change majors if she decides that is not what she wants to do.
And Many, many universities have undergraduate internships during the
summer.
And yes, there are several other avenues that will allow her to work
with animals. Forestry, wildlife technicians, zoo personnel, etc. The
jobs are there for those who are persistent enough.
Kelly C. Kissane
Grad student
Central Michigan University
arachnology/animal behavior
From: IN%"k9acad@iafrica.com" 30-JAN-1997 10:10:50.97
To: IN%"Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Advice
> I am a retired veterinarian with quite a bit of practical experience
> with aggressive dogs. Lately I consult with attorneys and victims of
> animal attack. One of my clients is in the courts now and the court has
> suggested that as terms of a settlement of a pending law suit, his
> neighbor will be directed to have his extremely vicious Rottweiler
> castrated and then undergo behavioral therapy. The man has already had
> his Husky nearly killed and his 16 year old daughter threatened. He
> likes the idea of castration (probably a little revenge) but he does not
> trust the idea of the dog getting psycho-therapy. Personally I go along
> with him, but I thought I'd ask the experts. Once bitten, twice shy.
> Thank you for any assistance.
> Sincerely,
> Robert E. Armstrong DVM MS
> Houston, TX
You did not mention where these attacks had taken place? I think the answer
will depend very much on the answer to that question. Did they take place on
the defendants property, the dogs property or public property?
Also under what circumstances? Was the dog on lead, did your client trip over
it, or did she or husky take food away from it? etc.etc.
Also you do not say how old the dog is - also very important because it's
unlikely castration will make any impression on a mature dog.
And as for "psycho-therapy" I guess all depends on the answers to the above
questions and very much so on the behaviour consultants experience!
**********************************************************
NAME : GLYNNE ANDERSON
ADDRESS: Canine Academy
32 Hospital Rd., Hillcrest 3610,
KwaZula Natal, South Africa.
TEL/FAX: (031) 751958
E-mail : k9acad@iafrica.com
WWW : http://webzonel.co.uk/www/apbc
**********************************************************
From: IN%"k9acad@iafrica.com" 30-JAN-1997 10:27:38.71
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Information
> Hi everyone, I introduced myself to all of you a couple of weeks ago,
> but for you new comers, my name is Ann, my daughter Lisa wants to study
> animal behaviour when she graduates from high school. She is a junior
> right now so she has a couple of years to decide. I need advise to
> share with her on this study. She knows that it's hard work but I don't
> think she realizes how time consuming and how monotonous the study can
> be. She also thinks that it's easy to get a job once you have a degree
> and that you can make lots of money doing this. Someone please e-mail
> her and tell her the facts. I don't want my only child making any
> decisions that she may regret later.
Annie
Maybe your daughter has a gift? If not why deprive her of the of making her
own mistakes?
Go for it Lisa!
GLYNNE ANDERSON
Pet Behaviour Consultant
(Loving every moment - money's not bad either!)
From: IN%"mkhd@earthlink.net" 30-JAN-1997 16:21:18.90
To: IN%"Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: aggressive Rottweiler Re: Advice
Behavioural therapies can be very effective in changing a dogs
behaviour (BTW this has very little to do with psycho-therapy). However,
I agree with D. B. Cameron that the basis for success is the owner's
full cooperation.
Yet, I'ld like to stress another point:
It is very unlikely that castration on its own is going to have any
major positiv effect on this particular dog's viciousness. In fact, the
Rotty could even turn worse after castration and attack both male and
female dogs. His hostility towards people is not going to be altered
anyway.
In this case it might be best to have the dog wear a muzzle and/or make
sure it is restrained safely to the owner's property.
Regards,
Sonja Doll-Sonderegger
MSc zoologist/applied ethologist
Dog behaviour therapist
From: IN%"galindof@servidor.unam.mx" "francisco galindo" 30-JAN-1997 16:53:56.48
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: Michael Phillips address
Hello everyone !!
Does anyone have Michael Phillips address?
He works on primate behaviour in the U.S.
Thanks
Dr. Francisco Galindo
Depto. de Etologia y Fauna Silvestre
Fac. de Medicina Veterinaria y Zootecnia
Ciudad Universitaria UNAM
04510 Mexico D.F.
MEXICO
Tel. 52 5 6225859
Fax 52 5 5508697
e-mail galindof@servidor.unam.mx
From: IN%"Scanwyre@aol.com" 30-JAN-1997 18:44:21.85
To: IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: Advice
Having dealt with aggressive dogs for many years I would question whether a
dog that has almost killed a husky and threatened a 16 year old daughter can
"merely"be treated with "therapy"and a castration . Rottweilers can be lethal
animals in the wrong hands , and in my experience once aggression takes over
,usually end up having to be put down .(I am not saying it is impossible but
I am saying it is very hard to ever trust such an animal 100%) . Could you
really afford to take a chance in such a case- a rottweiler is no play thing
!
Geraldine Ranken
From: IN%"arion@dialatlanta.com" "Chris Redenbach" 30-JAN-1997 22:10:38.32
To: IN%"bob-nita@neosoft.com" "Robert E. Armstrong"
CC: IN%"Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
Subj: RE: Advice
Robert E. Armstrong wrote:
>
> I am a retired veterinarian with quite a bit of practical experience
> with aggressive dogs. Lately I consult with attorneys and victims of
> animal attack. One of my clients is in the courts now and the court has
> suggested that as terms of a settlement of a pending law suit, his
> neighbor will be directed to have his extremely vicious Rottweiler
> castrated and then undergo behavioral therapy. The man has already had
> his Husky nearly killed and his 16 year old daughter threatened. He
> likes the idea of castration (probably a little revenge) but he does not
> trust the idea of the dog getting psycho-therapy. Personally I go along
> with him, but I thought I'd ask the experts. Once bitten, twice shy.
> Thank you for any assistance.
> Sincerely,
> Robert E. Armstrong DVM MS
> Houston, TX
Dear Dr. Armstrong:
It would seem that the first order that the court should give would be
one to assure that the Rottweiler will be safely contained on his
owner's property. Even if the owner is willing to comply with the order
to train and modify the behavior of the dog, he cannot possibly control
all the variable stimuli in an "at large" situation. People often react
to Rottweilers in ways that obviate an aggressive response. Rottweilers
are very territorially protective and very sensitive to possession and
social dominance issues. They also tend to enjoy the thrill they get
from intimidation.
Huskies can also be quite scrappy with other dogs and are known for a
tendency to roam, so one might also guess that the Husky could have been
on the Rott's turf.
You did not provide enough information about the occurrence and any
history prior to the injury of the Husky. Nor did you say if the girl
was "threatened' during the same incident or at a different time or
times. You did not say whether the label "extremely vicious" was yours,
the court's or the plaintiff's. Vicious is a very big word that, by
itself, almost completely negates the possibility of success in turning
the situation around.
1. Dog / dog aggression is very different than dog / human aggression.
One is not predictive of the other.
2. There is a great deal of "superstition" surrounding Rottweiler
aggression these days, so that it takes very little to elicit a less
than thoughtful response to any incident of aggressive behavior by a
Rottweiler. A painstaking analysis of the facts and background are
necessary, as is an analysis of what occurred during the most recent
incident to decide whether this occurrence contributes to the likelihood
of future problems by the way it was handled or not handled.
3. Most of the Rotts I see in my practice are more likely to be overtly
dog aggressive than people aggressive, and when they do show aggression
towards people it is usually very ambivalent due to massive emotional
confusion brought on by the mixed signals they have received all through
puppyhood...meaning that the owner profile that often acquires a Rott,
does so due to a combination of wanting a protection dog, macho image,
what Dr. Bruce Fogle called the "I am a lion tamer!" owner who secretly
enjoys a lack of control over the dog and the aggressive image, and then
promptly brings up the dog in total confusion. They become afraid of the
normal puppy biting stage that all breeds go through and usually use
corporal punishment for it, thus making the pup confused and defensive.
Then they encourage the pup to be paranoid by asking it "Who's there?
Who's there?" even when there is no one there, so they teach it not to
trust its own superior senses for detecting the presence of someone.
They encourage it to bark at people who are doing nothing to be barked
at, then they scold it for barking or growling at people who are doing
more intrusive things. Example: bark at the guy across the street, but
don't bark under pain of punishment at Uncle Ed who comes walking into
the yard or house without waiting to be greeted.
4. Although many rotts go out of control these days, one would need to
examine the percentages since they are so incredibly populace. Most that
I meet are not likely to be so threatening to humans that they would
pose an unacceptable threat if properly contained on the owner's
property or under the owner's direct control and supervision. I am
presently working with a lady who owns 5 rotts, 3 of whom managed to
escape one evening and kill a neighbor's goat. These dogs are not
aggressive towards people, although two of them tend towards fearfulness
and will back up growling if they are approached by a person who is
acting unsure or overtly assertive. It would be very normal for a
teenage girl to consider this behavior a threat although this dog would
dive through fire to avoid a confrontation. While I do not feel that
they have good temperament, I do not feel that they are, separately, any
threat to adolescent or adult humans. Of course, after any incident of a
prey kill, I could not say that they would be safe around
pre-adoloescent children.
The focus of the behavior balancing and training that I am doing is
twofold: 1. teach the owner how to express benign but very self assured
leadership so that the dogs are willing to cooperate and obey without
becoming stressed, confused or defensive; and 2.create in the dogs a new
emotional association regarding the approach of people to alleviate the
stressed and defensive feeling and allow the dog to look forward to
making new friends.
In the case of the Rott you are speaking of, the effects of neutering
take time and are less comprehensive the older the dog, so this is of
less short term significance than fencing and training. The results of
training will depend upon the degree to which the problem is genetic;
the way the key elements of the problem are identified and interpreted
by the trainer / counselor; the understanding and compliance of the
owner; the knowledge and competance of the trainer in choosing
techniques that will both change the dog's motivation and teach the dog
not to make his own decisions; the effectiveness of containing the dog
in a way that outside stimuli will not continually compete against the
behavior modifications attempted; long term consistency.
Please inform me as to the results, and feel free to fill in any
additional details. I tend to sway towards the possibility of success
unless the facts are overwhelmingly stacked against it. However,
aggression problems are the most frequently misunderstood.
Sincerely,
Chris Redenbach
arion@dialatlanta.com
Alliance Dog Training School
Lawrenceville, GA
From: IN%"Scanwyre@aol.com" 31-JAN-1997 00:14:05.83
To: IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: an hysterical dobermann
Hello Fred ,
In my experience when a dog is absolutely carzy and difficult about having
their toe nails clipped it's because they have had a bad experince sometime
during their former years . Whilst I was still in practice in Denmark I found
it usually helped if I doped the dog down with methadone and then cut his
townails . In the UK that would not be possible but any drug that would make
the dog unable to move but capable of observing what is happening around him
- ie dormitor could I think be used .
The idea of the treatment is as follows :The dog is basically stoned out of
it's mind and therefor unable to complain about the nail clipping procedure
and if you make an effort to demonstrate while it is under the influence that
the procedure does not inflict pain (in other words do not cut the nails so
they bleed , as that is a painfull procedure and usually the original cause
that made the dog so upset when getting it's toe nails cut ) . Usually this
procedure only has to be done once or twice and whereas the dog is never 100%
happy when you cut it's nails it will have understood that it is not as bad
as he thought and will usually stand still and let you get on with it .
Geraldine Ranken
From: IN%"Anna.Olsson@sjv.se" "Anna Olsson" 31-JAN-1997 02:03:26.70
To: IN%"applied-ethology-error@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: animal behaviourists in Portugal
Dear Dr Paixao,
it was interesting to hear your comments on the debate about rage syndrome
in dogs. And I was very happy to hear from a veterinary behaviourist in
Portugal. Since my husband - to -be is Portuguese, working at the
University of Porto, I am looking for contacts within my field in
Portugal, in order to find work there in the future. I would like to
get in touch with people who work with behaviour of domestic animals
in Portugal. As I understand, the field is not so big yet, but after
seeing your name I got more optimistic.
My own background is an MSc in animal husbandry with ethology as my
specialisation. At the moment I work for the Swedish Board of Agriculture,
with questions concerning animal housing/welfare and organic animal
husbandry. Before this, I spent one year doing behavioural research
(stress and rearing conditions) at Wageningen Agricultural University
in the Netherlands.
It would be great if you would write a few lines and tell me a bit more
about what you work with and the activities in your field in Portugal!
Yours sincerely,
Anna Olsson
animal housing & welfare - organic animal husbandry
Swedish Board of Agriculture
Division for Animal Production and Management
S-551 82 Jonkoping
Sweden
e-mail Anna.Olsson@sjv.se
tel +46-36-155000
fax +46-36-308182
From: IN%"appleby@petbcent.demon.co.uk" "David Appleby" 31-JAN-1997 04:54:03.27
To: IN%"applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca"
CC:
Subj: RE: aggressive Rottweiler Re: Advice
On Thu, 30 Jan 1997 17:21:41 +0000 Dr. Martin K.-H. Doll wrote:
>Yet, I'ld like to stress another point:
> It is very unlikely that castration on its own is going to
have any
>major positiv effect on this particular dog's viciousness. In fact, the
>Rotty could even turn worse after castration and attack both male and
>female dogs. His hostility towards people is not going to be altered
>anyway.
There is an article on the behavioural effects of canine castration at:
http://webzone1.co.uk/www/apbc/articles.htm
All the best.
David
============================================
Name:David Appleby
Address:The Pet Behaviour Centre,
Upper street, Defford, Worcestershire.
WR8 9AB.England.
Phone and fax:+44(0)1386 750615
E-mail:appleby@petbcent.demon.co.uk
WWW: http://webzone1.co.uk/www/apbc/pbc.htm
============================================