Subject: VS: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: Randi Helene Tillung Date: Sat, 01 Sep 2007 12:29:37 +0200 To: Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca, applied-ethology@usask.ca Fra: Randi Helene Tillung [mailto:randihelene@tillung.no] Sendt: 1. september 2007 12:29 Til: 'Zen Trainer' Emne: SV: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels Interesting suggestions! I have already thought about the DAP, but as the rooms are large and long the diffuser would not work as intended. We could use the spray on arrival, but as you say – it is quite expensive. We already have installed music in the rooms J I don’t think I would like to use any medication on a regular basis. A lot of factors can have a general effect on the welfare of the dogs. Do you know of any specific effects these treatments would have? :)Both anectodal and scientifically proved? (Can wait for science to prove everything J) ------------------- What my worries are when it comes to sep anx (on returning home) is that the dog might seem fine during boarding. Sometimes when we treat dogs with sep anx, a part of the rehabilitation is actually to board the dog in our kennel. We do advise that, when the owners for practical reasons cannot follow the protocol 100%. That may be due to work situation, family issues ++ We all know that months of training can ruined if the dog is left alone in a fashion it cannot master. So then we first test to see if the dog shows signs of sep anx in the kennel. They usually don’t as they have company with other dogs. Then the owner can leave the dog with us, and go about their business without worrying about the dog. Our experience with this is good; especially with dogs that enjoys dog-dog-interactions. For them the kennel might feel like a safer place than home. So, as we in the kennel do not see the immediate effect on the dog of any treatment, I was looking for studies done on factors involved in sep anx on returning home. I will of course follow any advice that can increase the dogs general welfare, but I would like to specifically know about how boarding can induce sep anx in home environment. Maybe this is more important than we think? Maybe if we looked closer and asked we would find that dogs with sep anx more often was boarded during special periods of their development/puppyhood? Have we seen such an effect on other species? Someone also suggested to look at human studies! I am thinking of suggesting this for a study for a master student. But if it is already studied, I won’t of course J Thank you! Randi Helene Tillung Norway Fra: Zen Trainer [mailto:ZenTrainer@hotmail.com] Sendt: 31. august 2007 02:03 Til: Ethics List Emne: Re: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels I wonder if something as simple as using Comfort Zone Plug In's (Dog Appeasing Pheromones) would do the trick? I use that when I know a dog will have a problem - when the owner has reported that the dog will. It's expensive so I don't use it all the time. Some vets do though, in their exam rooms. Rescue Remedy is in the water of all animals staying here, unless they are all so comfortable they think they live here. I do in home, cage free boarding so it's a bit different from a kennel. I have also used all forms of valium. Valerian Root (herbal valium), Calm's Forte (homeopathic valium) and the real stuff- diazepam. At vet clinics I have worked at we have used lavender or cedar aromatherapy (usually oil in a lamp ring) to calm dogs, as well as playing soothing music. I know that there are studies on music in kennels, I am willing to bet there are on DAP, the rest is just my anecdotal experience. I've been boarding for over 10 years now. Tracy B Ann www.zenpaws.com "The Politics of Dogs" www.radiofreenashville.org What I am especially looking for this time is not so much what do to after the onset, but more on how I could prevent it to happen in our kennel in the first place. Randi Helene Tillung M.Sc in Canine Ethology Subject: Re: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: Zen Trainer Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2007 13:40:52 -0500 To: Randi Helene Tillung CC: Ethics List Interesting suggestions! I have already thought about the DAP, but as the rooms are large and long the diffuser would not work as intended. ***The DAP works for up to 800 sq feet I believe, that's a lot of space!*** A lot of factors can have a general effect on the welfare of the dogs. Do you know of any specific effects these treatments would have? :)Both anectodal and scientifically proved? ***All of my suggestions are to calm a dog. I think you can't be calm and anxious at the same time, eh? At a vet clinic I worked at they bought Rescue Remedy by the case (not really a drug - no side effects, can't take too much etc.) and used these little mini crock pots with aromatherapy oils and water mixed. I think there are probably lots of studies on DAP. Homeopathy and Aromatherapy - not so much I bet.*** ------------------- So, as we in the kennel do not see the immediate effect on the dog of any treatment, I was looking for studies done on factors involved in sep anx on returning home. Thank you! Randi Helene Tillung Norway ***Do you actually get reports from owners that dogs who did not have SA on arrival had it when they got home? That seems a bit odd to me. The dogs I get with SA come to me with it. In over 10 years I have never had anyone report that their dog had it after returning home as a result of being here. That could be the type of boarding that I do though - cage free in home, running about on 2 acres with a bunch of other dogs. There is no real separation to be experienced. The dogs with SA that I board usually have attachment issues and I help the owners fix that. Some dogs can't (or the owners won't) fix the problem so there are some nervous dogs that aren't too happy here at times, but they wouldn't be happy anywhere without their owner. Many owners have mentioned that their dogs seem depressed when they leave here and often sleep for at least a day. I explain that they aren't depressed they are exhausted. It's like soccer camp here and not many dogs are used to having so many other dogs to play with or so much room to play in. (That's one of the big selling points, people love getting a tired dog back!) Have you read Patricia McConnell's booklet "I'll be Home Soon! How to Prevent and Treat Separation Anxiety"? It's fairly interesting. She also lists references for behavior protocols, diagnostic criteria and treatment. I can send them to you if you don't have the booklet.*** Tracy B Ann www.zenpaws.com "The Politics of Dogs" www.radiofreenashville.org Subject: Re: VS: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: catbehavior@cox.net Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2007 18:48:57 -0400 To: Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca, Randi Helene Tillung , applied-ethology@usask.ca Hello Randi, I have done a fairly extensive literature research on attachment, stress, and anxiety, but my focus is on felines - not canines. However, for what it may be worth, below are some ideas for you. (By the way, DAP also makes a DAP collar, but will be expensive too, and may be of concern if dogs are in a kennel situation. They fit snugly, but are not break-away collars.) Applied Animal Behavioural Science journal had a couple of articles in July's issue this year that dealt specifically with the use of DAP. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/journal/01681591 There is a group of researchers in Budapest, Hungary that have done numerous studies on dogs, attachment, separation, and the like. Vas, Judit, Department of Ethology, Eotvos University, Pazmany P. 1/c, H-1117, Budapest, Hungary (Some of the researchers: Topál, Miklósi, Csányi, Pongrácz, and Gácsi) Another group in Milano, Italy have too done many studies on dogs, attachment, and separation (Palestrini, Previde, Mondelli, and others) - in a recent article they looked specifically at disruption of early attachments with guide dogs for the blind. Do disrupted early attachments affect the relationship between guide dogs and blind owners? Fallani, Gaia; Previde, Emanuela Prato; Valsecchi, Paola; Applied Animal Behaviour Science, Vol 100(3-4), Nov 2006. pp. 241-257. Here in the USA, James Serpell [University of Pennsylvania: School of Veterinary Medicine] and CIAS (Center for the Interaction of Animals in Society) and has a very nice listing of articles, and has looked specifically at the behavioral development in companion dogs. http://www2.vet.upenn.edu/research/centers/cias/ I also came across one article that sounds very close to what you might be looking for, but I do not have access to the journal, nor am I familiar w/the journal, so cannot tell you much about it. The journal is called Journal of Veterinary Behavior: Clinical Applications and Research. It appears to be a relatively new journal. http://www.journalvetbehavior.com/home. The article title and abstract are below: November 2006, Vol. 1 Issue: Number 3 p109-120, 12p Relationship between attachment to owners and separation anxiety in pet dogs (Canis lupus familiaris) Dogs' dysfunctional attachment relationships with their owners are assumed to be the underlying cause of separation anxiety. Thirty-two dogs with and 43 dogs without owner-reported separation anxiety (SA) participated in a formal attachment test (AT). After the AT, the dogs were videotaped for 30 minutes while alone at home. Dogs left free in the house were scored on how long they were in proximity to the owners' exit doors. Dogs who were crated or closely confined were scored on several anxiety-related behaviors, which were then compared to those dogs' behaviors during the attachment test. Dogs with SA spent no more time in contact with or proximity to their owners during the attachment test than dogs without SA (P>0.05). Instead, they tended to jump up on the door after the strangers left the room and remain stationary when alone with their owners (P<0.05). There was no significant difference (P>0.05) between SA and non-SA dogs in the amount of time spent in proximity to the owners' exit doors when left alone at home. Dogs crated at home showed no relationship between the amount of anxiety-related behaviors during the AT or at home (P>0.05). There was no significant difference in the type of proximity-seeking behaviors exhibited by dogs with and without SA in the home (P>0.02). These finding suggest that separation anxiety is not based on ''hyperattachment'' of the dog to the owner, but that a different attachment style may be present between dogs with and without SA. Finally, another article that may be helpful - older (1977) but may be useful Revista Latinoamericana de Psicología, Vol 9(2), 1977. pp. 247-257 The development of social affect: Effects of early experiences upon separation distress. Reviews the process of primary socialization, including social attachment, in dogs. Separation distress in the form of vocalizations first appears during the transition period (at about the time the eyes are first open) and increases with age up to 21 days. An experiment was conducted on the effects of repeated short experiences of separation in puppies in 2 situations, constant and changing surroundings. Vocalizations were gradually reduced at similar rates in both situations, leading to the conclusion that reduction of the response is due to habituations. However, habituation took place extremely slowly compared to other emotional responses such as fear, and was never complete. Separation distress is therefore an extremely persistent and long-lasting emotional response. Cheers, Kitty ---- Randi Helene Tillung wrote: Interesting suggestions! I have already thought about the DAP, but as the rooms are large and long the diffuser would not work as intended. We could use the spray on arrival, but as you say - it is quite expensive. We already have installed music in the rooms :-) I don't think I would like to use any medication on a regular basis. A lot of factors can have a general effect on the welfare of the dogs. Do you know of any specific effects these treatments would have? :)Both anectodal and scientifically proved? (Can wait for science to prove everything :-)) ------------------- What my worries are when it comes to sep anx (on returning home) is that the dog might seem fine during boarding. Sometimes when we treat dogs with sep anx, a part of the rehabilitation is actually to board the dog in our kennel. We do advise that, when the owners for practical reasons cannot follow the protocol 100%. That may be due to work situation, family issues ++ We all know that months of training can ruined if the dog is left alone in a fashion it cannot master. So then we first test to see if the dog shows signs of sep anx in the kennel. They usually don't as they have company with other dogs. Then the owner can leave the dog with us, and go about their business without worrying about the dog. Our experience with this is good; especially with dogs that enjoys dog-dog-interactions. For them the kennel might feel like a safer place than home. So, as we in the kennel do not see the immediate effect on the dog of any treatment, I was looking for studies done on factors involved in sep anx on returning home. I will of course follow any advice that can increase the dogs general welfare, but I would like to specifically know about how boarding can induce sep anx in home environment. Maybe this is more important than we think? Maybe if we looked closer and asked we would find that dogs with sep anx more often was boarded during special periods of their development/puppyhood? Have we seen such an effect on other species? Someone also suggested to look at human studies! I am thinking of suggesting this for a study for a master student. But if it is already studied, I won't of course :-) Thank you! Randi Helene Tillung Norway _____ Fra: Zen Trainer [mailto:ZenTrainer@hotmail.com] Sendt: 31. august 2007 02:03 Til: Ethics List Emne: Re: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels I wonder if something as simple as using Comfort Zone Plug In's (Dog Appeasing Pheromones) would do the trick? I use that when I know a dog will have a problem - when the owner has reported that the dog will. It's expensive so I don't use it all the time. Some vets do though, in their exam rooms. Rescue Remedy is in the water of all animals staying here, unless they are all so comfortable they think they live here. I do in home, cage free boarding so it's a bit different from a kennel. I have also used all forms of valium. Valerian Root (herbal valium), Calm's Forte (homeopathic valium) and the real stuff- diazepam. At vet clinics I have worked at we have used lavender or cedar aromatherapy (usually oil in a lamp ring) to calm dogs, as well as playing soothing music. I know that there are studies on music in kennels, I am willing to bet there are on DAP, the rest is just my anecdotal experience. I've been boarding for over 10 years now. Tracy B Ann www.zenpaws.com "The Politics of Dogs" www.radiofreenashville.org What I am especially looking for this time is not so much what do to after the onset, but more on how I could prevent it to happen in our kennel in the first place. Randi Helene Tillung M.Sc in Canine Ethology Subject: Re: VS: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: catbehavior@cox.net Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2007 18:48:57 -0400 To: Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca, Randi Helene Tillung , applied-ethology@usask.ca Hello Randi, I have done a fairly extensive literature research on attachment, stress, and anxiety, but my focus is on felines - not canines. However, for what it may be worth, below are some ideas for you. (By the way, DAP also makes a DAP collar, but will be expensive too, and may be of concern if dogs are in a kennel situation. They fit snugly, but are not break-away collars.) Applied Animal Behavioural Science journal had a couple of articles in July's issue this year that dealt specifically with the use of DAP. http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/journal/01681591 There is a group of researchers in Budapest, Hungary that have done numerous studies on dogs, attachment, separation, and the like. Vas, Judit, Department of Ethology, Eotvos University, Pazmany P. 1/c, H-1117, Budapest, Hungary (Some of the researchers: Topál, Miklósi, Csányi, Pongrácz, and Gácsi) Another group in Milano, Italy have too done many studies on dogs, attachment, and separation (Palestrini, Previde, Mondelli, and others) - in a recent article they looked specifically at disruption of early attachments with guide dogs for the blind. Do disrupted early attachments affect the relationship between guide dogs and blind owners? Fallani, Gaia; Previde, Emanuela Prato; Valsecchi, Paola; Applied Animal Behaviour Science, Vol 100(3-4), Nov 2006. pp. 241-257. Here in the USA, James Serpell [University of Pennsylvania: School of Veterinary Medicine] and CIAS (Center for the Interaction of Animals in Society) and has a very nice listing of articles, and has looked specifically at the behavioral development in companion dogs. http://www2.vet.upenn.edu/research/centers/cias/ I also came across one article that sounds very close to what you might be looking for, but I do not have access to the journal, nor am I familiar w/the journal, so cannot tell you much about it. The journal is called Journal of Veterinary Behavior: Clinical Applications and Research. It appears to be a relatively new journal. http://www.journalvetbehavior.com/home. The article title and abstract are below: November 2006, Vol. 1 Issue: Number 3 p109-120, 12p Relationship between attachment to owners and separation anxiety in pet dogs (Canis lupus familiaris) Dogs' dysfunctional attachment relationships with their owners are assumed to be the underlying cause of separation anxiety. Thirty-two dogs with and 43 dogs without owner-reported separation anxiety (SA) participated in a formal attachment test (AT). After the AT, the dogs were videotaped for 30 minutes while alone at home. Dogs left free in the house were scored on how long they were in proximity to the owners' exit doors. Dogs who were crated or closely confined were scored on several anxiety-related behaviors, which were then compared to those dogs' behaviors during the attachment test. Dogs with SA spent no more time in contact with or proximity to their owners during the attachment test than dogs without SA (P>0.05). Instead, they tended to jump up on the door after the strangers left the room and remain stationary when alone with their owners (P<0.05). There was no significant difference (P>0.05) between SA and non-SA dogs in the amount of time spent in proximity to the owners' exit doors when left alone at home. Dogs crated at home showed no relationship between the amount of anxiety-related behaviors during the AT or at home (P>0.05). There was no significant difference in the type of proximity-seeking behaviors exhibited by dogs with and without SA in the home (P>0.02). These finding suggest that separation anxiety is not based on ''hyperattachment'' of the dog to the owner, but that a different attachment style may be present between dogs with and without SA. Finally, another article that may be helpful - older (1977) but may be useful Revista Latinoamericana de Psicología, Vol 9(2), 1977. pp. 247-257 The development of social affect: Effects of early experiences upon separation distress. Reviews the process of primary socialization, including social attachment, in dogs. Separation distress in the form of vocalizations first appears during the transition period (at about the time the eyes are first open) and increases with age up to 21 days. An experiment was conducted on the effects of repeated short experiences of separation in puppies in 2 situations, constant and changing surroundings. Vocalizations were gradually reduced at similar rates in both situations, leading to the conclusion that reduction of the response is due to habituations. However, habituation took place extremely slowly compared to other emotional responses such as fear, and was never complete. Separation distress is therefore an extremely persistent and long-lasting emotional response. Cheers, Kitty ---- Randi Helene Tillung wrote: Interesting suggestions! I have already thought about the DAP, but as the rooms are large and long the diffuser would not work as intended. We could use the spray on arrival, but as you say - it is quite expensive. We already have installed music in the rooms :-) I don't think I would like to use any medication on a regular basis. A lot of factors can have a general effect on the welfare of the dogs. Do you know of any specific effects these treatments would have? :)Both anectodal and scientifically proved? (Can wait for science to prove everything :-)) ------------------- What my worries are when it comes to sep anx (on returning home) is that the dog might seem fine during boarding. Sometimes when we treat dogs with sep anx, a part of the rehabilitation is actually to board the dog in our kennel. We do advise that, when the owners for practical reasons cannot follow the protocol 100%. That may be due to work situation, family issues ++ We all know that months of training can ruined if the dog is left alone in a fashion it cannot master. So then we first test to see if the dog shows signs of sep anx in the kennel. They usually don't as they have company with other dogs. Then the owner can leave the dog with us, and go about their business without worrying about the dog. Our experience with this is good; especially with dogs that enjoys dog-dog-interactions. For them the kennel might feel like a safer place than home. So, as we in the kennel do not see the immediate effect on the dog of any treatment, I was looking for studies done on factors involved in sep anx on returning home. I will of course follow any advice that can increase the dogs general welfare, but I would like to specifically know about how boarding can induce sep anx in home environment. Maybe this is more important than we think? Maybe if we looked closer and asked we would find that dogs with sep anx more often was boarded during special periods of their development/puppyhood? Have we seen such an effect on other species? Someone also suggested to look at human studies! I am thinking of suggesting this for a study for a master student. But if it is already studied, I won't of course :-) Thank you! Randi Helene Tillung Norway _____ Fra: Zen Trainer [mailto:ZenTrainer@hotmail.com] Sendt: 31. august 2007 02:03 Til: Ethics List Emne: Re: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels I wonder if something as simple as using Comfort Zone Plug In's (Dog Appeasing Pheromones) would do the trick? I use that when I know a dog will have a problem - when the owner has reported that the dog will. It's expensive so I don't use it all the time. Some vets do though, in their exam rooms. Rescue Remedy is in the water of all animals staying here, unless they are all so comfortable they think they live here. I do in home, cage free boarding so it's a bit different from a kennel. I have also used all forms of valium. Valerian Root (herbal valium), Calm's Forte (homeopathic valium) and the real stuff- diazepam. At vet clinics I have worked at we have used lavender or cedar aromatherapy (usually oil in a lamp ring) to calm dogs, as well as playing soothing music. I know that there are studies on music in kennels, I am willing to bet there are on DAP, the rest is just my anecdotal experience. I've been boarding for over 10 years now. Tracy B Ann www.zenpaws.com "The Politics of Dogs" www.radiofreenashville.org What I am especially looking for this time is not so much what do to after the onset, but more on how I could prevent it to happen in our kennel in the first place. Randi Helene Tillung M.Sc in Canine Ethology Subject: Re: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: gflannigan@triad.rr.com Date: Mon, 03 Sep 2007 10:10:58 -0400 To: Zen Trainer CC: Randi Helene Tillung , Ethics List With respect to DAP, the study below looks at its effect on separation anxiety. There is also a recent study on the positive effect of DAP collars on puppies in a training class (author: Dr. Sagi Denneberg). Vet Rec. 2005 Apr 23;156(17):533-8. Links Comparison of the efficacy of a synthetic dog-appeasing pheromone with clomipramine for the treatment of separation-related disorders in dogs.Gaultier E, Bonnafous L, Bougrat L, Lafont C, Pageat P. Phérosynthèse, Le Rieu Neuf, 84490, Saint-Saturin-les-Apt, France. Sixty-seven dogs that showed signs of distress when separated from their owners (destructiveness, excessive vocalisation and house soiling) and hyperattachment were used in a randomised, blind trial to assess the potential value of a dog-appeasing pheromone in reducing the unacceptable behaviours. For ethical reasons, there was no placebo group and the effects of the pheromone were compared with the effects of clomipramine which is regularly used to treat this type of problem. The undesirable behaviours decreased in both groups, but the overall assessment by the owners indicated that there was no significant difference between the two treatments, although there were fewer undesirable events in the dogs treated with the pheromone, and the administration of the pheromone appeared to be more convenient. PMID: 15849342 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Gerry -- Gerrard Flannigan DVM MSc. DACVB gflannigan@triad.rr.com Subject: Re: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: peterhaskins Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2007 15:09:40 +1000 To: ethology I wonder, then. If Rescue Remedy actually *worked*, I would expect that it did so through the expectations of the staff OR the process of delivering the Rescue Remedy to the animals? So maybe the problem of anxiety of dogs in kennels might be better addressed by better training/selection of people actually working with the animals. Jenny Haskins Not a "believer" in any medicinal value of very diluted brandy in water. ***All of my suggestions are to calm a dog. I think you can't be calm and anxious at the same time, eh? At a vet clinic I worked at they bought Rescue Remedy by the case (not really a drug - no side effects, can't take too much etc.) . . .*** Subject: Rescue Remedy From: Zen Trainer Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2007 10:32:05 -0500 To: peterhaskins CC: Ethics List Jenny, I wanted to tell you how I came to believe in Rescue Remedy. For years I lived with 3 cats and moved around a lot, every year or so. Every time I moved the cats would freak and pee everywhere. For about 2 weeks before the move and two weeks after. It started the minute the boxes came out. Lovely. This happened 4 times at least. When I was not moving the cats were all great about only using the litter boxes. Right before one move it was suggested that I give Rescue Remedy to the cats (you apply it to their body, which they are not particularly fond of but you do it while they are eating or sleeping). I was taking it for myself but didn't see any effect. I also didn't trust any effect I might see. Amazingly enough, the cats did not pee anywhere except the litter box during that move while using Rescue Remedy, and seemed to find great enjoyment jumping in and out of the moving boxes. That happened for my next 3 moves as well. I could see no way in which my believing it might work would effect the cats (especially since I did *not* believe it would work.). I don't see how the process of delivering it to them would help either - it pretty much annoyed them. Since cats don't drink much and won't drink water or eat food with anything weird in it, you have to apply it to their bodies. (With dogs you can put it in their water or food, on their bodies or straight in their mouths.) So I became a believer. Later, while working with a Homeopathic Vet I came to fully accept homeopathy, though I don't begin to understand it. P.S. My grandmother would beg to differ with you on the medicinal value of brandy. I swear she thought it was the cure for everything, cuts, colds, coughs, etc. LOL! ----- Original Message ----- From: peterhaskins To: ethology Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 12:09 AM Subject: Re: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels I wonder, then. If Rescue Remedy actually *worked*, I would expect that it did so through the expectations of the staff OR the process of delivering the Rescue Remedy to the animals? So maybe the problem of anxiety of dogs in kennels might be better addressed by better training/selection of people actually working with the animals. Jenny Haskins Not a "believer" in any medicinal value of very diluted brandy in water. ***All of my suggestions are to calm a dog. I think you can't be calm and anxious at the same time, eh? At a vet clinic I worked at they bought Rescue Remedy by the case (not really a drug - no side effects, can't take too much etc.) . . *** Subject: SV: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: Randi Helene Tillung Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2007 11:52:08 +0200 To: Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca, applied-ethology@usask.ca Thank you everyone for your contribution! I am still at loss with the question of “what is the prevalence of privately owned dogs developing SA after staying at a boarding kennel”. But I have had many good suggestions for treating SA here. Kayce says: I find that histories, while interesting, are not critical for solving the problem. I fully agree with that! But history is interesting for assessing risk. Has the dog show signs before etc. (Whatever the risk factors are). I would want to turn down dogs before arrival if I knew that the risk was great. All of you would agree that it is better to prevent than treat J Tracy – you ask: “Do you actually get reports from owners that dogs who did not have SA on arrival had it when they got home? That seems a bit odd to me. The dogs I get with SA come to me with it. In over 10 years I have never had anyone report that their dog had it after returning home as a result of being here” As I said earlier I have never had anyone report this after a stay in our kennel. BUT I am not saying that it will never happen. We have room for over 70 dogs at a time. A colleague that works with behaviour problems recently had two cases in a short span of time, where the owner says that the dog was fine before boarding. I know nothing about these particular dogs or the kennels they used. I would love to learn more about this. Meanwhile we still advise our clients to have the dogs in for an introductory programme. Especially with puppies/young dogs. The dogs are then boarded only from the morning to the afternoon or shorter. We welcome them especially, monitor them and report honestly back to owner. If they do fine they are allowed to stay one night in the kennel a bit later etc. Do any of you know of another introductory programme for kennels? BTW I feel in agreement with Jenny saying that people/handlers is a crucial element of reducing anxiety. That is also consistent with findings on farm animals and their welfare. ----------- Off topic: What I am always surprised by is how different dog owners are. Some dogs do perfectly, but owners are still very concerned. Once in a while we get dogs that do not seem to settle down. Especially one dog comes in mind. She pants, shivers, is reluctant to go into her kennel and drools. I have in detail told the owner that, even after we have tried everything (we feel), she is not happy with being in the kennel. I have advised her to put an ad in the newspaper to get her boarded in a home with loving people. The owner couldn’t care less. So we still have the dog coming, because I do not want the dog to go to a different kennel where they might not even see that the dog has issues. We usually put the dog with a nice and young dog of the same gender, as she seems to calm more down then. But I always feel so sorry when I see the dog. ---------- Anyway – I agree that reducing anxiety is the focal point. Although, saying that is almost like saying “be nice to the dog”. It is not very to the point, if you see what I mean J Thank you for all the detailed suggestions that can help in reducing anxiety. I don’t know really if I should be happy or sad that we have already implemented most of them in the system. Happy because it makes me feel that we do a lot. Sad because I wish I could do more. Yours, Randi Helene Tillung Subject: Re: SV: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: doggiepause@comcast.net Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2007 14:34:30 +0000 To: Randi Helene Tillung , Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca, applied-ethology@usask.ca This has been a very interesting thread for me. I have not responded to this point, as I have no formal background in ethology. What I DO have is a dog daycare, with boarding, that I have operated for the past 8 years. (It is a very small facility, averaging 30 in daycare and 9 boarding.) Never have had an owner report that the dog began showing SA sx after boarding. We have had number of dogs who have come to us that have issues to begin with. Virtually all of them have been dogs who were adopted from shelters, which is consistent with info I have read. (But don't ask me where. . . ) Since all dogs who come to us for boarding are also in daycare (open play) during the day, they all go through the evaluation process. This is a half-day where I gather info about the dog, then introduce new dog to others in the group, one at a time. Dog gets lots of 1:1 human attention throughout the day -- something we can m anage because we're so small. If the dog appears anxious by the end of the day, I may either refuse the dog or tell the owner that the dog will need to come back for daycare half-days a couple more times to see if he settles in. This is generally, but not always, what happens. If I don't see improvement by the 3rd visit, I refuse the dog. Before I learned to do this, I sometimes took dogs that were over-anxious. Sometimes it worked out, they calmed down & got used to being here. Sometimes it was a nightmare of whining, barking and fence-jumping. Hope this is of interest to someone. I would love to see more research done with shelter dogs on this issue. I don't have the background, but maybe I could help gather data. (Old (very old) psych major). Judy Gee Doggie Pause ltd. Englewood, CO 303.761.8743 -------------- Original message -------------- From: Randi Helene Tillung Thank you everyone for your contribution! I am still at loss with the question of “what is the prevalence of privately owned dogs developing SA after staying at a boarding kennel”. But I have had many good suggestions for treating SA here. Kayce says: I find that histories, while interesting, are not critical for solving the problem. I fully agree with that! But history is interesting for assessing risk. Has the dog show signs before etc. (Whatever the risk factors are). I would want to turn down dogs before arrival if I knew that the risk was great. All of you would agree that it is better to prevent than treat J Tracy – you ask: “Do you actually get reports from owners that dogs who did not have SA on arrival had it when they got home? That seems a bit odd to me. The dogs I get with SA come to me with it. In over 10 years I have never had anyone report that their dog had it after returning home as a result of being here” As I said earlier I have never had anyone report this after a stay in our kennel. BUT I am not saying that it will never happen. We have room for over 70 dogs at a time. A colleague that works with behaviour problems recently had two cases in a short span of time, where the owner says that the dog was fine before boarding. I know nothing about these particular dogs or the kennels they used. I would love to learn more about this. Meanwhile we still advise our clients to have the dogs in for an introductory programme. Especially with puppies/young dogs. The dogs are then boarded only from the morning to the afternoon or shorter. We welcome them especially, monitor them and report honestly back to owner. If they do fine they are allowed to stay one night in the kennel a bit later etc. Do any of you know of another introductory programme for kennels? BTW I feel in agreement with Jenny saying that people/handlers is a crucial element of reducing anxiety. That is also consistent with findings on farm animals and their welfare. ----------- Off topic: What I am always surprised by is how different dog owners are. Some dogs do perfectly, but owners are still very concerned. Once in a while we get dogs that do not seem to settle down. Especially one dog comes in mind. She pants, shivers, is reluctant to go into her kennel and drools. I have in detail told the owner that, even after we have tried everything (we feel), she is not happy with being in the kennel. I have advised her to put an ad in the newspaper to get her boarded in a home with loving people. The owner couldn’t care less. So we still have the dog coming, because I do not want the dog to go to a different kennel where they might not even see that the dog has issues. We usually put the dog with a nice and young dog of the same gender, as she seems to calm more down then. But I always feel so sorry when I see the dog. ---------- Anyway – I agree that reducing anxiety is the focal point. Although, saying that is almost like saying “be nice to the dog”. It is not very to the point, if you see what I mean J Thank you for all the detailed suggestions that can help in reducing anxiety. I don’t know really if I should be happy or sad that we have already implemented most of them in the system. Happy because it makes me feel that we do a lot. Sad because I wish I could do more. Yours, Randi Helene Tillung Subject: Re: SV: Separation anxiety and boarding kennels From: doggiepause@comcast.net Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2007 14:34:30 +0000 To: Randi Helene Tillung , Applied-ethology@sask.usask.ca, applied-ethology@usask.ca This has been a very interesting thread for me. I have not responded to this point, as I have no formal background in ethology. What I DO have is a dog daycare, with boarding, that I have operated for the past 8 years. (It is a very small facility, averaging 30 in daycare and 9 boarding.) Never have had an owner report that the dog began showing SA sx after boarding. We have had number of dogs who have come to us that have issues to begin with. Virtually all of them have been dogs who were adopted from shelters, which is consistent with info I have read. (But don't ask me where. . . ) Since all dogs who come to us for boarding are also in daycare (open play) during the day, they all go through the evaluation process. This is a half-day where I gather info about the dog, then introduce new dog to others in the group, one at a time. Dog gets lots of 1:1 human attention throughout the day -- something we can m anage because we're so small. If the dog appears anxious by the end of the day, I may either refuse the dog or tell the owner that the dog will need to come back for daycare half-days a couple more times to see if he settles in. This is generally, but not always, what happens. If I don't see improvement by the 3rd visit, I refuse the dog. Before I learned to do this, I sometimes took dogs that were over-anxious. Sometimes it worked out, they calmed down & got used to being here. Sometimes it was a nightmare of whining, barking and fence-jumping. Hope this is of interest to someone. I would love to see more research done with shelter dogs on this issue. I don't have the background, but maybe I could help gather data. (Old (very old) psych major). Judy Gee Doggie Pause ltd. Englewood, CO 303.761.8743 -------------- Original message -------------- From: Randi Helene Tillung Thank you everyone for your contribution! I am still at loss with the question of “what is the prevalence of privately owned dogs developing SA after staying at a boarding kennel”. But I have had many good suggestions for treating SA here. Kayce says: I find that histories, while interesting, are not critical for solving the problem. I fully agree with that! But history is interesting for assessing risk. Has the dog show signs before etc. (Whatever the risk factors are). I would want to turn down dogs before arrival if I knew that the risk was great. All of you would agree that it is better to prevent than treat J Tracy – you ask: “Do you actually get reports from owners that dogs who did not have SA on arrival had it when they got home? That seems a bit odd to me. The dogs I get with SA come to me with it. In over 10 years I have never had anyone report that their dog had it after returning home as a result of being here” As I said earlier I have never had anyone report this after a stay in our kennel. BUT I am not saying that it will never happen. We have room for over 70 dogs at a time. A colleague that works with behaviour problems recently had two cases in a short span of time, where the owner says that the dog was fine before boarding. I know nothing about these particular dogs or the kennels they used. I would love to learn more about this. Meanwhile we still advise our clients to have the dogs in for an introductory programme. Especially with puppies/young dogs. The dogs are then boarded only from the morning to the afternoon or shorter. We welcome them especially, monitor them and report honestly back to owner. If they do fine they are allowed to stay one night in the kennel a bit later etc. Do any of you know of another introductory programme for kennels? BTW I feel in agreement with Jenny saying that people/handlers is a crucial element of reducing anxiety. That is also consistent with findings on farm animals and their welfare. ----------- Off topic: What I am always surprised by is how different dog owners are. Some dogs do perfectly, but owners are still very concerned. Once in a while we get dogs that do not seem to settle down. Especially one dog comes in mind. She pants, shivers, is reluctant to go into her kennel and drools. I have in detail told the owner that, even after we have tried everything (we feel), she is not happy with being in the kennel. I have advised her to put an ad in the newspaper to get her boarded in a home with loving people. The owner couldn’t care less. So we still have the dog coming, because I do not want the dog to go to a different kennel where they might not even see that the dog has issues. We usually put the dog with a nice and young dog of the same gender, as she seems to calm more down then. But I always feel so sorry when I see the dog. ---------- Anyway – I agree that reducing anxiety is the focal point. Although, saying that is almost like saying “be nice to the dog”. It is not very to the point, if you see what I mean J Thank you for all the detailed suggestions that can help in reducing anxiety. I don’t know really if I should be happy or sad that we have already implemented most of them in the system. Happy because it makes me feel that we do a lot. Sad because I wish I could do more. Yours, Randi Helene Tillung Subject: cloning breeding animals From: Anna Olsson Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 10:21:48 +0100 To: applied-ethology@usask.ca Dear all, (apologies for asking a non-ethology question but one where I'm sure you will be able to help): In December last year FDA issued report stating "Edible products from normal, healthy clones or their progeny do not appear to pose increased food consumption risks relative to comparable products from conventional animals." One would expect this to spark the interest in commercial cloning of breeding animals in particular in the FDA 'jurisdiction' - does anybody know if any US (or other) breeding company has stated interest and investment in this? Best regards, Anna Olsson Dr Anna Olsson Researcher Laboratory Animal Science group http://www.ibmc.up.pt http://ethos.no.sapo.pt Institute for Molecular and Cell Biology - IBMC Rua Campo Alegre 823 4150-180 Porto, Portugal Phone +351 22 607 4900 Fax +351 22 6099157 Subject: RE: cloning breeding animals From: Ray Stricklin Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 07:43:12 -0400 To: 'Anna Olsson' , applied-ethology@usask.ca Anna Olsson wrote: from conventional animals." One would expect this to spark the interest in commercial cloning of breeding animals in particular in the FDA 'jurisdiction' - does anybody know if any US (or other) breeding company has stated interest and investment in this? ----------------- Dear all, A number of companies already exist in the USA that have developed cloned animals intended to be marketed commercially. A good resource for info on Biotechnology (in total, not just cloning) is the Pew Initiative web site which can be found at: http://pewagbiotech.org/ (But note that this web page contains the following statement, "The Pew Initiative on Food and Biotechnology concluded its work at the end of March 2007. The materials developed by the Initiative are archived here to serve as a continuing resource for all interested parties.") One of the last activities this initiative sponsored was a one-day symposium entitled, "Animal Biotechnology: Considering Ethical Issues." Dr. Barbara Glenn gave a presentation entitled: Introduction to Technologies, Potential Applications and Products which can be viewed at: http://pewagbiotech.org/events/1018/speakers/glenn.php Barb is currently Director of Animal Biotechnology, Biotechnology Industry Organization (http://www.bio.org/) and one of her responsibilities seems to be lobbying in support and advancement of biotechnology - both pharmaceutical and agricultural. Membership in her organization includes agricultural firms that have lines of clones for the commercial market. (Barb was previously the executive vice president of the American Society of Animal Science.) The one-day symposium was followed by a two-day workshop: http://pewagbiotech.org/events/1019/ I would say that animal agriculture had a strong representation in support of cloning/biotechnology during the workshop. A list of participants can be found near the end of the workshop report: http://pewagbiotech.org/events/1019/WorkshopReport.pdf A number of persons strongly expressed their wish that the Pew Initiative on biotechnology continue to be supported. However, I think the Pew Initiative personnel may have felt that the chasm of viewpoints was too wide. There was broad support for the use of biotechnology to improve human health. However, outside of the representatives from animal agriculture, there was little support for the use of biotechnology to bring about increased "productivity" in individual animals used for food production. And I think this split was part of the motivation for the Pew personnel ending the project as it relates to food production. From the discussion and other activities at this combined three-day event, I got an impression that some of the representation from FDA verged on being uninformed, unprofessional, and unimpressive in terms of dealing with the ethical and broader issues related to regulating animal biotechnology. However, in fairness to FDA, the agency is charged with using ONLY one criterion in their regulation of products. FDA can only regulate on the basis of safety (for humans) of products - which in my opinion needs to be changed by Congress. But I got the impression that at least some of the FDA reps were perfectly happy to have safety remain the only consideration, not only for FDA but for any and all agencies developing policy. Best regards, Ray Stricklin